Significantly Not As Described return for refund....if buyer pays for return shipping

[namestreetcity]

According to the Paypal process when you file a claim for an item that is significantly not as described, you must return the item at your cost in order for Paypal to issue a refund for the amount you paid, not the return shipping costs. You have 10 days to provide Paypal with a tracking number. Paypal doesn't allow you to post a reply. You send the item back or in 10 days the claim is closed.

Buyers are being forced to pay to received goods the seller didn't described accurately, and in some cases, honestly.

I think that is wrong.

When you can prove that an item is significantly not as described, then Paypal should refund your entire costs of the item including shipping both ways. Sellers can take advantage of Paypal's forcing buyers to pay for return shipping.

If a buyer doesn't like something or changes their mind, and wants to return it, then the return shipping should be paid by the buyer.

[ferd]

This is ridiculous. Please people stop piling on with the constant complaints. Ebay/PayPal is not Solomon. It can't be everything to everyone and you can't always expect everything to go your way.The losing side always feels like they've been wronged. There is no way to make everyone happy 100% of the time especially when it comes to bitter disputes.

And if you feel truly ripped off as in the case of Ebay motors transactions, call the police. Paypal can only do so much and Ebay is only a listing service. Stop being lazy and expecting them to do everything for you including your dirty work. Outright fraud is a criminal matter and needs to be dealt with through law enforcement, not through the listing service you made the transaction on. Last time I checked, PayPal does not have police powers and filing claims are no substitute for contacting the police.

This is just message after message of  redundant and often contradictory griping. "Ebay isn't fair to sellers." "Ebay isn't fair to buyers." And my favorite, "I am a buyer and a seller, and Ebay is unfair to me in both roles." LOL. Which is it? And folks, how do we know your shrill indignant stories of being 'ripped off' are accurate? Maybe you the one who was doing the ripping off and these little anecdotes are a cover. Or perhaps your interpretation of events is biased and inaccurate and in fact Ebay was in the right to side against you. There are two sides to every story. If the dispute went the other way, we'd have the other party on here complaining about how Ebay/PayPal is bad for not siding with them.

As for private feedback, if you don't like it, don't deal with the person who has it. Maybe some people like their privacy, maybe some people sellers think the negative feedback they are getting isn't fair and that public feedback unfairly hurts them. It's an option. Options are good folks. They have the option of private feedback, you have the option of avoiding them. And you just know that if Ebay banned private feedback people would howl about that too and find ways to claim that it's unfair.

Personally, as a buyer Ebay has been great to me. If you don't like it, stop using it and take your constant whining somewhere else.

By the way, the original premise of this subject is inaccurate. It's not Ebays call to force sellers to refund shipping costs even if the buyer feels there was a fundamental misrepresentation of the product. In the eyes of the law, shipping costs have nothing to do with the costs of the product itself. They are separate charges for a reason. So you're blaming PayPal/Ebay for something they really have no control over. Saying that buyers should have their shipping costs refunded when they feel the product is significantly not as described is a lame as saying that buyers should get refunds on the price of the product itself when they feel the shipping was too slow and/or badly done.

[marcos10]

You are true in what you say but when it happens to you feel differeent. Have you ever been ripped off like some people have wither receiving garbage mercvhandise or have to be responsible for return postage and then ask for addional moiney for something so called better instead. Who would trust them. Have you ever been ripped off. Money is money especially when yopu pay andf buy in good faith. 

[Paulmono38]

Ferd ferd ferd no take this personaly but are you accusing some people here to make fraud?  where do you think are you writting on a wall beach? this theme is for what you are complaining about? according you is all right if we received any garbage and take back and pay the shipping too and that according you you are a seller too maybe am saying maybe you are like one those that sell garbage and saying you are selling that are limons we complaing here because we have a reasson to do so, that not because we wanted not person reasonable want to loss his time on this we want to be heard maybe the police change and make to pay that garbage seller that sell garbage instead of limons

[xmjsilverx]

I am having the same problem.  I got the item that I originally filed the claim for not receiving but it was not as described.  The seller filed a claim because I have not closed the dispute.  I have emailed paypal several times explaining why I have left it open and I get the same canned responses.  I have no way to communicate with them or the seller and they will end up closing it.  And if I have to pay shipping to ship it back it will be worthless anyway.  Always use your credit card even when using paypal, you can call your credit card company and tell them to stop payment.  Eventually paypal will not accept credit cards and they will go down the tubes.

[gr8flded]

So, as a small time seller on Ebay, lets say i sell my iPhone which is in perfect condition.  The buyer gets the item, uses it for a week and breaks it or scratches it up.  The buyer then can simply file a "Not As Described" complaint, return to me a now ruined item, and be refunded all the money (minus the small shipping return cost).  THIS does not seem fair to me...and is why, as a seller, i will NEVER again accept payment from PayPal.  Tell me how this is fair to a seller or why the seller should take such a risk?

[BINOVC]

Apparently FERD has never received a Significantly Not As Described item.  Or if he has, he must have been completely happy paying the shipping costs (or just keeping the item).  I don't know what school of fairness he's from.  It certainly isn't the one I learned at, where I was taught to take responsibility for my mistakes.

I'm sure his points about paypal having to follow the law are probably correct, and quite possibly paypal has no choice in their SNAD shipping policies.  However it is also true that responsible sellers DO agree to refund the item plus shipping cost (both ways) if they mistakenly send the incorrect item.  This happend to me twice in succession now.  The items were clearly not what the seller described, and both sellers quickly sent me return shipping labels.  One then refunded my auction, the other sent the correct item.  Both items were "free shipping", so that was included in the refund.

This of course does not address "bad" sellers or buyers who take advantage of the current policies and try to **bleep** you.  I've had this happen as well.  Although paypal did not require the seller to refund my shipping cost, paypal did refund me.  I'm thinking that I've been lucky so far, reading some of the horror stories in this thread.

[wsto1]

Bought counterfeit Led Zeppelin Box set. Paypal says I need to take to a store to verify it is fake!!! meanwhile this Zepplin seller from China is changing his identity & continues to sell these bogus sets. So he made money & so did paypal!!! Why does paypal not stop it??. I will tell you because they are making a profit off these counterfitters!! My feedback & reputation & effort should tell them I am honest, and if they would spent 5 minutes checking the sellers reputation they would know he is selling junk. They figure if they put buyer through the ringer they will just give up accept the counterfit loss & go on. Counterfit seller knows this!!. Paypal doesn't lose a dime!!. If you buy a counterfit cd, just resell it to some other poor person, apparently that is the best policy with ebay & paypal!!

[lovethesun]

I read most of the comments on this topic.  I, too, am being forced to pay return shipping, and my item was FAKE!  I made every attempt to note it as a fraud claim, but guess what.  You can pick "didn't receive item" OR "item significantly different than descrribed".  So I could not put it in a fraud category.

Should I pay to return a fake item to a seller to get my refund?  I don't think so....then some other poor buyer will have to go through this process, AND I just paid at least $10 to get ripped off! 

If there is a way to file a "I received a fake or knock off item" I missed it, please inform me.

Oh, and by the way, I can't cancel the original "not as rec'd" claim and file a new one,  Everything is wrong with paypal in this scenario.

[chuck2003]

Let me tell everyone a story, sad but true...    I have been on ebay for several years, had 100% positive feedback for all the time, I recently sold an item for a friend who didn't have an account.  I took photos of the item and placed the description with all defects.   A guy "torb" won the auction (who later I found out has a record of ripping people off with the same type items and has neg. feedback to show), my friend shipped the item to him promptly via UPS, I got the check from paypal a couple of weeks later and gave it to my friend.  A couple weeks later the buyer contacted me and said that he would like a refund because the wheel I sold him had "a little damage", and was worse than the same type item he was buying it to replace (hint), oddly it was supposed to be the same type damage (hint),  ***THE AUCTION WAS AS IS NO REFUNDS*** in any event, but the item was not damaged in this respect anyway, only a few scratches on it as listed.    The buyer took it upon himself to remove parts of the item and replace with damaged ones, or either swapped the item for a damaged one and sent a photo of it per my request to see the item damage as he said, the item he sent the photo of was a different color, had much different defining scratches, and one VERY different and noticable difference, so I sent him a msg. telling him of the difference, he admitted he altered and removed the emblem, to replace it with another one he had won on ebay, but said it was the same item other than that.   I told him that if it was damaged it would have been done during shipping via UPS, he should file a claim with UPS since he was not going to return the item to me.  Note that he had a background of switching items for damaged ones with others that I had just found out too...    He finally attempted to get $100, which is more than the item sold for or he would file a claim with ebay and paypal against me.  I contacted ebay and spoke to them at length about it, which they said not to worry about it, not a problem for me in the situation.  However the buyer filed a claim with paypal which placed my account in a neg. balance for the amount of the item while they "investigated" it, would take over a month as it seems, the buyer still has the item, I cannot now pay for other items that I  have purchased on ebay, and will be getting a neg. feedback due to the lack of ability to pay with paypal, and refusing to pay and get a damaged exchange for a good item that was sent to him.    I will suffer due to this and tried to do what was right with the buyer, I would have refunded him anyway had he not sent a photo of a different item, and showing major damage.  The guy is borderline committing a crime under state law (theft by deception), or often known as bait and switch.  Paypal will cause damage to my account with future transactions due to this.   I guess every business eventually gets too involved into trying to be judges and not have the ability or expertise to be a judge and dictate justice correctly, and thereby causes much worse damages in an event.    I forsee someone starting a company to rivel paypal very soon due to this, and it seems alot more people are seeing the same point.

[ccking2]

I do not agree, many times buyers file this claim simply because they are having finacial problems or have had a change of heart, and the seller pays to ship it to them so it is only fair that the buyer pays to ship it back. Not every claim is a legitmate claim.