PayPal pending payment

socrcoach17
New Community Member

I would like to hear from someone at PayPal the answers to several specific questions relating to the pending payment policy. I have read the various threads on this, and the relevant section of the Terms of Service Agreement, but these are questions not answered elsewhere.

 

FIrst, the background. Like so many others here, I was caught by surprise when payment was held up for an item I sold on eBay. The item sold for $455 and because it is heavy and bulky, the shipping charge was $225 (in the actual fact, it cost me more than that amount to pack and ship and I ate the difference). The winning bidder paid immediately via PayPal. PayPal immediately marked this as a "pending" payment. The item was shipped less than 48 hours after the auction closed and delivered yesterday. I supplied the tracking information to PayPal/eBay as instructed. The payment still shows simply as "pending" and when I click on "Details" I am told that status applies for another 14 days, OR 3 days after PayPal can determine that the item was delivered, OR 3 days after the buyer leaves positive feedback.

 

There is no way for me to verify that PayPal/eBay knows now that the item was, in fact, delivered yesterday. There is no way to know when and if a change in pending status has occurred. The policy is ambiguous as to whether delivery even matters for an eBay auction item, or if only positive buyer feedback will release the funds in less than 21 days.

 

QUESTION 1: If the item was sold pursuant to an eBay auction, is the pending status changed when the SOONER OF or LATER OF the two listed events occur: provable delivery or positive buyer feedback? How can I verify that PayPal now knows the item was delivered and, therefore, that the 3-day clock has started to count down?

 

PayPal positions itself as the most convenient way for a seller to accept payments, especially on eBay transactions. I was charged a $20+ fee for this transaction. I had to front the $225 shipping charge. I now have to wait an arbitrary amount of time for payment, with no feedback from PayPal as to status before or after the buyer submitted his PayPal payment transaction. In the very best case, the funds will hit my bank account two weeks from when the auction closed because of the holiday weekend.

 

QUESTION 2: Why is this good for me as a seller? You are charging me premium transaction fees, what service am I AS A SELLER getting in return for this policy and the fees charged?

 

The most basic tenet of contract law is that the parties have to agree to the terms in order for there to be a contract. PayPal's Terms of Service Agreement relating to pending payments is hopelessly vague, to the degree that I question that it constitutes a contract. It would not be a valid contract for me to say, for example, "I can do whatever I want for any reason" and for you to agree, and for me to then take your car and your house. I could argue that your agreement was stupidity on your part (which is, essentially, PayPal's response to sellers in the various threads and is vaguely insulting), but I could not defend such capricious actions in court based on that "contract." Particularly in a dependent situation like this

 

The PayPal pending payment policy does not, for example, let me know, as a seller, whether I or any given transaction are subject to being pended, what I can do to prevent it, or what specific criteria PayPal will use. PayPal relies on terms like "high risk" that clearly mean something very different to the sellers who have spoken out in this forum than they mean to PayPal. In no way would I, as a reasonable seller, read the text of the TOSA and interpret it as meaning what PayPal is, in fact, doing. You are doing things that are not reasonable interpretations that a reasonable seller would be expected to conclude are consistent with the TOSA's language. They appear to be arbitrary and capricious and unrelated to the stated policy.

 

In short, a seller "agreeing" to the TOSA can have no basis for understanding what it now turns out PayPal means by those words.

 

QUESTION 3: How does the TOSA, regarding pending payment holds, constitute a valid contract, given that you provide no way for the seller to know what he/she is agreeing to and that reasonable sellers clearly think you are interpreting this language in ways opposite to the way they understand it?

 

Given that PayPal relies on its "sole discretion," there is an implied obligation for the policy and its enforcement to rationally relate to its purpose.

 

As with so many others, there is no evidence in my case of any kind of a problem. This was a personal sale, but I own a company that accepts credit cards based in large part on my own credit history, and have had no problem with approvals for those transactions from banks, or any problems with any specific transactions. There is no history of complaints against me personally or my company, I have no criminal history, no financial fraud, solid credit rating, bank account has been verified. In other words, PayPal has reached a decision about my "risk" that is opposite what other financial institutions that provide similar services have concluded.

 

QUESTION 4: How does the pending payment discretion policy of PayPal rationally relate to actual risks to buyers, its putative purpose? What does the term "high likelihood" mean anyway - 50%? 10%? 1%? What statistical evidence does PayPal have that the criteria used are predictive of a "high likelihood" (whatever that means) of buyer dissatisfaction? Is there any such evidence at all that eBay frequency is a reliable predictor, or is this just someone's guess?

 

Clearly, this policy benefits PayPal financially. You get the benefit of interest on the funds while they are in pending status. It is like travellers checks - the financial institution makes money on the float. Therefore, PayPal has set itself up with a clear conflict of interest, between fairly interpreting ambiguous or discretionary sections of the TOSA, e.g., what constitutes "risk" to buyers, and what is financially beneficial for PayPal.

 

QUESTION 5: Will PayPal remove this conflict by paying interest on the funds held? If not, how can you claim to not have an egregious conflict of interest in your unilateral interpretation of the TOSA?

 

Login to Me Too
489 REPLIES 489

Dano27
Contributor
Contributor

Follow these steps to remove “payment holds” from your account (please note if your item has not been delivered these steps will not work).

1)      Log-in to paypal and click ‘help’ (located at the top right corner of the site)

2)      Then click on ‘Contact Us’ (located at the bottom right corner of the site)

3)      Directly under the title ‘Email Us’ is a link labeled ‘Send us’, click this link.

4)      Fill this in with the appropriate info (don’t go into detail on your issue at this time, just vaguely create a sentence that sums up your problem)

5)      Afterwards you will receive an email that’s labeled something like this ‘Auto-Response Payment Status  (XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX) ppk1’ from a specific email address (i'm not allowed to post the exact address on these forums for some reason) .

6)      Reply to this address and give this information:

     a)      Paypal transaction ID #

     b)      Shipping provider (UPS, Fedex, USPS, etc.)

     c)       Tracking # for the item

     d)      And then describe in full detail the situation of your transaction.

7)      If you’ve met Paypal’s requirements for hold release, then they will lift the payment holds.

You may have to do this per transaction.

Hope this helps - Dan

Login to Me Too

tinkerbellfan
Contributor
Contributor

I totally agree with socrcoach. This is ridiculous. It all benefits PayPal in the end. They get to keep all of our money in "their bank accounts" ot collect interest. I don't understand how it is fair that the person I sold my item too has the item in their hands probably enjoying every minute of it, but I don't have any money to show for it. I swore I would never use Ebay or PayPal again because of this issue & here I am once again. 

 

I have emailed the buyer of my item 4-5 times to just ask them if they received the item & I have yet to hear anything back from them. 

 

I wasn't aware that Ebay owned PayPal & now that I am aware I will never use them again. They charge you fees on Ebay for listing the item, they a fee when you sell the item, then you have to pay a fee to PayPal for the processing of the payment, so that means Ebay/PayPal is making a huge profit between the 2 companies, WHAT A FREAKIN JOKE. They should be ashamed of them selves.

 

We need to get more people to "BOY-COT" both companies & see how they like that.

 

Isn't there some kind of class action lawsuit that can be done for these 2 companies???? I wish I could join one.

Login to Me Too

CHIEFRANNY
Contributor
Contributor

HOW THE **bleep** AM I SUPPOSED TO SHIP THE ITEM IF THE HOLD THE MONEY - ARE THE FRICKIN SLOW!!!!

Login to Me Too

systemlord
Contributor
Contributor

Wow, I must say that I'm surprised to see a long thread (40 pages) about this pending balance scam, four days ago through eBay, eBay is able to confirmed not only delivery confirmation, but delivery confirmation with an adult "signature required" for delivery signed for as of last Friday. So why am I here...? You do not need a high school diploma to figure out what is really going on here, PayPal is clearly making excuses to why our money is being withheld, PayPal can not give you one single reason why your money is being withheld and this makes me feel like I'm being manipulate and taken advantage of!!

 

Now for the shocker, I have been allowed to purchase from NewEgg Computers an Nvidia Geforce GTX 480 $559.93 dollar graphics card that PayPal shows as payment complete and I'm taking delivery tomorrow Tuesday the May 11th! I also purchased an amplifier on Ebay for which I will also take delivery tomorrow, yet I'm unable to transfer my PayPal balance to my bank account...? Huh? Oh I almost forgot, my pending balance is still frozen and nothing has been deducted from my PayPal balance to pay for the graphics card or amplifier...? Huh?

 

A message to PayPal, If you think you can manipulate and take advantage off our money for the foreseeable future you are sadly mistaken!!

 

Douglas Fitzpatrick

Login to Me Too

heavenly
Member
Member

I really frustated with this things also

 

you can call them to release the payment if already delivered 3 days after

 

but seems like we have nothing to do except keep on call and checking about this things ? plus paypal need to pay more employee because of this things

 

they can get interest because hold our money especially after delivered 3 days

I think paypal should pay us the interest too if they hold our money more than 3 days after delivered

 

Login to Me Too

mikes1947
Member
Member

paypal **bleep**

Login to Me Too

kristab
Member
Member

big class action suit being brought against Paypal for this ...stay tuned....if they are holding your funds, you'll be part of it. It is illegal.

Login to Me Too

Ted_Maul
Contributor
Contributor

Dear Amanda

 

You're kind of missing the point and not answering the questions. I know I can get the money before 21 days. Thank the Lord I can. But it's not as straight forward as you think it is. Especially when you are playing with money that sellers, and I'm going out on a limb here, need.

 

Plus. Buyers don't know about this rule, they get hassled by sellers and sellers get left high and dry whilst Paypal sits on their money.

 

Example: The first time this happened to me I sold a reasonably priced item specifically to have money for Christmas. The item was delivered before Christmas day however the buyer had know idea about the payment pending rule and (although was perfectly happy with the item especially as I had busted a gut to get it to her before Christmas day) didn't leave + feedback immediately.

 

Am not sure how you can say it gives Buyers confidence when they don't even know about it.

 

I then had to send emails to her to ask for + feedback. She didn't understand what I was going on about as the funds had left her account and ignored my emails. Where's the sellers' protection? Waiting 21days?. I had to send three emails (almost harassing, which is not a good way to get +feedback) asking if she was happy and if she could be kind enough to leave feedback if she was to release the funds. This concluded about two weeks into January.

 

I didn't get the money I needed for Christmas which in turn meant direct debits being missed and me incurring bank charges after I had provided a perfect transaction, made extra special effort to deliver an item before Christmas. So in short  what reward did I get for using Paypal to make a, as you put it, "successful transaction"? £90/$140 charges from my bank, more than halving the value of my sale. Paypal however got their fees and sat on the buyer's/seller's money for nearly three weeks for a more than perfect transaction. How is that a  "successful transaction" or "helps to manage costs effectively for everyone"?

 

My long winded point being it isn't as smooth-and-rosy-and-everybody's-happy as you think.  Buyers aren't always able to leave immediate + feedback. Not all buyers know their money is being held. Seller's could have perfectly legitimate reasons that may cause the buyer (not all buyers are perfect you know) to not leave positive feedback so the 21 day rule kicks in.  I have had to email my most recent buyer to tell them I can't mail until I get their money or other funds. They agreed that had I specified up front not to bother with Paypal they would have been perfectly happy to do a bank transfer direct to me,BEFORE they received the item. 


Cheers

 

 

 

Login to Me Too

shawnhensontn
Contributor
Contributor

here is what i just had to email to a customer.   THANK YOU PAYPAL.

 


Good news. eBay item #220561479635 Lexmark X1150 All-In-One InkJet Printer

Paypal is currently holding  money in a pending account. which means i cant access the money to ship out your printer. I have 50.00+ in "pending" status 
I can refund your money and when there is "cleared" funds in paypal i can ship it out (BUT THEY ARE HOLDING FOR 21 DAYS) I Doubt you want to wait. I can refund your money back and when its clear i can notify u then (which im sure i will loose the sale.

Sorry for the problem but i can keep u waiting for your product.

Login to Me Too

shawnhensontn
Contributor
Contributor

how do show that the item was delivered.. there is no BUTTON to notify paypal of this

Login to Me Too

Haven't Found your Answer?

It happens. Hit the "Login to Ask the community" button to create a question for the PayPal community.