Bought from Shady Website

[wingsofyourhear]

i bought some dvds from a shady looking website that uses Paypal checkout system.

http://www.japanweekend.com/tienda/index.php

I HAVE already PAID for the items with paypal using Paypal checkout system.

2 days have now passed.

-i emailed the seller asking whether my item has been shipped, there's no response to this day.

-i called the seller, but his phone number is not in service.

-i saw him posting stuff on twitter and facebook a while ago, so i sent him a message there, but he deletes it.

so just to be on the safe side,

i've already opened a "item not receive" claim against him a few hours ago.

but there's still something i'd like to know:

*(1) as soon as a paypal merchant receives money, would he be able to immediatly send it to his other paypal accounts for safe keeping? (thus paypal can't freeze it or take it back from him?)

*(2) if Mr. Scammer has already transfer all the money off his PP account to his mother's PP account, does it mean that although i've opened a claim against him, i will have no chance of getting my money back?

oh and his paypal account is unverified by the way.

YES! i knew beforehand it was a shady place to buy, but his shop is the only place that still sell a rare dvd sets that have been out of print for years. i was well prepared to open a claim against him as soon as he doesn't respond for 2 days, and that's exactly what i have done to protect myself.

Please don't bash me for shopping at a shady place.

From my experience lots of ugly and shady looking websites turned out to be genuine, ligitimate businesses. (would be happy to show you some of my favourites!) i have shopped in plenty of ugly and shady looking websites before and the sellers there have always fulfilled their end of the deal. Never ran into any trouble until now.

i have done my research prior to posting here, here's what i know so far.

* i know that paypal holds funds for 21 days for newer ebay sellers. 

But there is no information on whether this applies to merchants outside of ebay.

* i also know that some "Powersellers" on ebay gets their funds released in 24 hours.

But what about merchants outside of ebay? do some of them get their funds released in 24 hours too? again there's no information about this on the internet at all.

so right now, my primary concern is this:

Is it possible for a merchant to empty their Paypal account in 2 days?

thanks for all the help, i much appriciate it!

[kernowlass]

A lot of this depends on how you PAID.

If you paid via send money > goods / services OR paid an invoice then you should be covered by buyer protection.

If you are covered by buyer protection then it does not matter if the seller does not refund you or does not have funds in their account balance. This is because if paypal find in your favour then if the seller does not refund paypal will refund you.

That is what there buyer protection is all about.

Personally i think a few days is way too soon to file a dispute on any seller as you have up to 180 days now to file a claim.

[wingsofyourhear]

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@kernowlass wrote:

If you paid via send money > goods / services OR paid an invoice then you should be covered by buyer protection.

---

I paid the merchant using the paypal checkout option in his online shop.

i am fully aware that i am covered by paypal protection.

what i want to know is if it would at all be possible that he had already emptied his paypal account during these past 2 days since i paid him. this is my primary concern.

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@kernowlass wrote:

if paypal find in your favour then if the seller does not refund paypal will refund you.

---

I think you should take a look at this then.

("After careful review, we have determined that the seller is at fault but
regret to inform you that we were unable to recover any funds from the
seller's account. As stated in the PayPal User Agreement, recovery of funds
associated with a Buyer Complaint cannot be guaranteed.")

If a seller empties their paypal account then there's NO MONEY for paypal to recover, is there?

so i don't quite understand what you meant by "paypal will refund you".

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@kernowlass wrote:

Personally i think a few days is way too soon to file a dispute on any seller as you have up to 180 days now to file a claim.

---

 because the money will still be there in the seller's account after 45 days/180 days, right?

-

the whole point of this thread was for me to make an inquiry on how long non-ebay merchants will have to wait before they can withdraw / transfer all the money off of their Paypal account, whereupon i will not be able to recover that money.

i sincerely hope that someone would be able to answer this question for me.

-

[kernowlass]

("After careful review, we have determined that the seller is at fault but
regret to inform you that we were unable to recover any funds from the
seller's account. As stated in the PayPal User Agreement, recovery of funds
associated with a Buyer Complaint cannot be guaranteed.")

Would you like to say how old that passage is?

Would you like to point out where this is in the user agreement > buyer protection on the site at the moment under legal agreements?

As far a i can recollect buyer complaint and buyer protection were 2 very old different policies that paypal had before buyer protection became the only one. 

[wingsofyourhear]

---

@kernowlass wrote:

("After careful review, we have determined that the seller is at fault but
regret to inform you that we were unable to recover any funds from the
seller's account. As stated in the PayPal User Agreement, recovery of funds
associated with a Buyer Complaint cannot be guaranteed.")

Would you like to say how old that passage is?

Would you like to point out where this is in the user agreement > buyer protection on the site at the moment under legal agreements?

As far a i can recollect buyer complaint and buyer protection were 2 very old different policies that paypal had before buyer protection became the only one. 

---

That passage was from 2009, before the implimentation of PP Buyer Protection.

This old policy is nowhere to be found in my current Paypal user agreement, therefore i assume it is no longer applicable to my present PP account.

The currently policy for PP Buyer Protection on my account is as follows:

-To be eligible for PayPal Buyer Protection you must meet all of the following requirements:

(For items bought on other websites:)

1: through the Send Money tab on the PayPal website, by clicking the “Purchase” tab, or by selecting the “Checkout with PayPal” button or otherwise selecting PayPal as part of a Seller’s checkout flow.

-7.4 Coverage Amount. If you are eligible for PayPal Buyer Protection and PayPal finds in your favor on your Claim, PayPal will reimburse you for the full purchase price of the item and original shipping costs.

My apologies, you are indeed correct on the new policy change, of which in my own ignorance i was not made aware of.

 Please pardon my over-cautious mentality. i am a weary buyer who've been subjected to one too many fraudulant sellers in the past.

But i still see my decision of initiating that speedy dispute/claim against the seller to be a sure and guaranteed means of securing the payment i made to the seller, who additionally is also an "unverified" paypal member.

I would be more than happy to close the dispute once he ships me what i ordered. Though i fear this is becoming less and less likely to happen as each day passes with him continuing to play hide and seek with me.

I will keep this thread updated until a resolution is finally reached between me and him.

I have been given 20 days to wait for the seller to respond, so i will give him the benefit of that at least.