Appeal against PayPal decision in the Resolution Centre

[kafka]

 I live in Australia. A buyer in the USA ordered a vinyl record from me and paid for it. I posted the item promptly. Some time later I received a complaint from the buyer through the resolution centre alleging that I had made an unauthorised withdrawal from his account. Due to the necessity to respond quickly I could not do much investigation. I responded to the complaint, pointing out that my accuser lived in the USA and that I had never heard of him and couldn't possibly have accessed his account. The only evidence I could provide was a scan of his eBay order. Shortly afterwards I received a ruling from PayPal which went against me on the grounds that I hadn't provided proof of shipping.

Much aggrieved, I did some detective work which seemed to support my defence. I was able to email the buyer who, much to my surprise, recalled receiving the record. He also told me that he would clear it up with PayPal. So far nothing has eventuated. I could live with the loss of the purchase price of the LP ($30) but not with the fine PayPal levied ($13) because it implies that I defrauded the buyer.

I have tried to make an appeal against PayPal's decision (I would include the buyer's email) but when I click on View on my case page nothing happens. On one page the case is described as closed whilst on th page showing the case it is shown as under review.

How can I contact PayPal to put my case?

[angelleye]

Did you provide the tracking information they asked for?

It's not necessarily implying that YOU committed fraud. It's simply saying that the payment was unauthorized. Somebody who "hacked" their account could have used it to make the purchase, for example.

If that sort of thing did happen, it could be that same fraudster that you're actually to. Not the actual owner of the account.

Was the transaction covered by Seller Protection? It would show you this in the original transaction details. If it was, and you shipped to the address on the transaction details with a track-able carrier, then you should win the original dispute.

It sounds like some of those details were missing..??

[kafka]

No, I could not provide tracking details nor shipping details. Paying for tracking or signature on delivery would have added to the shipping costs and made the item less attractive to potential buyers. The fact that PayPal fined me $15 implies that they saw me as the person who had made the unauthorised payment. If this was not the case, why would they fine me? It is usually, if not always, the person who has committed the offence who is penalised.

I still don't know how I can appeal and attach various pieces of evidence, including the buyer's admission that he received the record.

[angelleye · Accepted solution]

You get charged the fee because banks charge a fee when they have to issue a "chargeback".

You chose not follow the standard procedures that are required to be covered by Seller Protection. That leaves you liable for any such chargebacks and associated fees.

Again, it does not mean they are saying you are the fraudster. It means they are saying that fraud occurred, and since you did not provide track-able shipping as required by Seller Protection, they can't prove that you sent the item, which means you are liable.

It will be very difficult to appeal at this point. You could try calling and respectfully requesting an appeal over the phone, but even if they do it, they're not going to accept a screenshot from you showing any "buyer's admission that he received the record."

The whole point is they need a 3rd party service to verify. The involved parties could easily falsify evidence, especially if one of them is indeed a fraudster willing to do that sort of thing.

I would recommend that you use this as a learning scenario and make sure you follow procedures if you want to be covered by Seller Protection in the future.

By the way, this same thing would occur with ANY payment processor. If you take a payment, and you don't ship with signature required and tracking available, you are going to be held liable.

[kafka]

Fair enough. I just hope the buyer does the right thing and withdraws is complaint.

[angelleye]

If it's a legitimate buyer, yes, hopefully they'll follow through and help out here.

Sometimes, though, fraudsters will continue to respond to something like this just to drag it out a little longer and try to buy more time.

Hopefully it all works out for you. Sorry this happened, but at least it wasn't for a more expensive transaction.

[kafka]

Thank you for your advice.

[kafka]

The buyer has contacted me by email and told me that he has received the item. He also told me that he had not complained to PayPal about an unauthorised access to his account and that he had contacted them and been told that they had no record of a complaint by him. Somebody has registered the complaint (perhaps it was his credit card company) and it is sitting in the resolution centre being reviewed. It is very frustrating that that I can neither appeal nor contact PayPal to inform them of the information received from the buyer.

[angelleye]

Credit card companies do not file disputes on behalf of their card holders. The card holder has to do it.

It really sounds to me like a fraudster just **bleep** with you. Again, they will often continue the conversation and act like they're still legit just to buy more time.

I'm a little confused now, though. Originally you were saying the claim was already closed and you were wanting to appeal it. Now you're saying it's still "Under Review". Which is it?

In either case, the fact that this person is claiming they did not submit the dispute leads me to believe it's bogus. Disputes don't just happen on their own, and you have to have access to the buyer PayPal account in order to file the dispute.

I guess one possibility could be, for example, a husband/wife that are not communicating well with each other. Maybe they both have access to the account, and one filed the dispute not knowing that the other had purchased something. Just grasping at straws.

Even then, though, if this buyer is truly legit and acting like they're unsure, they would be able to see the dispute on their side under the Resolution Center. If it's still under review, they could potentially respond saying they did indeed receive it, and that would solve the problem.

So if they really are a legit buyer, ask them to do that (if the claim is still under review.)

[temp20210714]

I had order a rocking chair with cushion. This product was coming from China for 37.88 . My order was place on May 27, 2021. I had became concerned I haven’t received any information regarding my item. I contacted PayPal and they contacted seller. I received a very small wooden toy that I can place in the palm of my hands! This item is not what I order for $37.88 and it has the same tracking number that the seller provided me and PayPal. I have learn over the years some of these sellers from China is a big fraud! And that PayPal needs to band sellers such as my experience of fraud! I work hard for my money there is no need to go back and forth with Dispute center when all information has been provided and I already paid money out of pocket. I didn’t received my product that was order for $37.88 dollars and I didn't order a tiny toy that was a dollar. The seller had offer to give me half of my money. This is not how business works! This is fraud and seller needs to be banded! I want my refund of $37.88 what I paid out of my account!