PayPal is not your pal

[Temp20221114b]

I just want to ask the comunity if the following situation is fair:

- I bought a solar inverter and paid with PayPal because of the so called "buyer protection"

- it came in 4 days from Germany to Romania with DHL

- inverter did not work properly and the seller did not respond to the messages so I opened a dispute

- finaly, seller agree to provide a full refund but provided a China address for the return. The shipping for the package would cost ~500$ (value of inverter was 780$)

- I asked Paypal to provide a European Union address for the return (I bought the item from EU) but they do not care and insist I need to send it wherever the seller wants

What kind of buyer protection is this? If I pay the shipping to China I only get back 280$ out of 780$. 

I opened a dispute through Revolut and the level of support I get from them is way better than the robots from Paypay which do not care about their customers.

Why use Paypal? The seller has to pay high commissions and the buyer has no protection. 

Why not using a credit card instead and you get cheaper and more secure transactions?

[kernowlass]

@Temp20221114b 

Chinese Web Sites or on Social Media ads easy to spot (once you know the below signs) so buyer beware.

Paypal would not be able to check every individual seller / merchant / company in over 200 countries worldwide that adds paypal to their website to accept payments.

So they give some buyer and some seller protection. However that protection can never be a 100% coverall so you need to read it so you can risk assess your transactions.

They do stop bad companies from using Paypal when enough claims start rolling in.
However as they are in China (mostly) then its easy for them to just start over with a new name, so stopping them does not really do anything.

The best thing is to not buy from them in the first place, to recognise them -

1. No return address on the returns policy. The site will look as if its in your country (where they despatch goods from) but they will ask for returns to go back to China (returns depot) at a shipping cost often more than the item is worth.
2. No contact telephone number. if you click on contact the most you will get is webmail or an email address.
3. Rarely company address information.
4. Great pictures of items at bargain prices that turn out to be tat.
5. Fake reviews.
6. Google and you can often see previous company names as they change them once enough claims roll in and Paypal stop them using their services and start over.
7. Send fake tracking numbers to win item non receipt of item claims.

[Temp20221114b]

Hi kernowlass, It's great from you that you spend your time helping the comunity with solid advice. You are right that we should watch where we spend our money, and this is what I thought I am doing. Look around you and acknowledge that your phone, laptop, smartwatch ...are all made in Asia. How would you feel if you would be required to ship your defective items to the manufacturer directly? Buying something from Germany should imply that the return of the goods should be also to Germany. Paypal has access to the tracking number of the aquired product but willingly allows the seller to use another return address even if I open a dispute and prove my case. It's all about the dirty money they take from commission. Paypal can refund the buyer and stop these practices. But they choose not to do it because they depend on the sellers $$$. Stop pretending like they are innocent .

[kernowlass]

@Temp20221114b 

That's the importance of checking 'returns' information on a website before you buy.

eg, last night I saw a nice item on Facebook (rarely do I even consider buying from S.M) but checked this one out.

Clicked on 'contact' only an email address, no physical address.

Clicked on 'return' and they stated to email them for information, no return address.

Clicked the back button pronto.

Lots of companies sell from international depots but use a central return depot, however most of them list that address and include it in their return information. If they don't then don't bother to buy from them.

I can only give you the facts as to how paypal works, I don't always agree with their policies but I also don't agree with folks not being responsible for their own actions and getting themselves scammed. That said will equally help every way I can to fight the scammer and help them get their funds back and have been successful hundreds of times.

So, you're welcome to the information, hope you can now recognise the scammers more easily.