Paypal horror story: $7,500 return to scammer lost in mail. What to do next?

[Alexe123]

It's absolutely a horror story. About three months ago already, I purchased a collectible from a man in the UK for $7,450. When it arrived, I was pretty excited, but then immediately horrified when I saw that he had sent me an absolutely useless item in its place. So, obviously, I immediately took the steps to file a case. I also sent the seller an email. Surprise! No response.

[A little later, I also contacted the Northamptonshire police department, who filed a fraud report with Action Fraud on my behalf. Apparently, this same guy had sold this same item 3 other times. A scam running approximately $30,000.]

After I escalated the case, PayPal requested that I provide documentation that the item was not as described. I sent in photographs of how the items obviously differed. "Not acceptable evidence." So I had to drive all over the place to find a dealer (there wasn't a local one due to the uncommon nature of the collectible), and then wait for them to draft up a letter--a $30 valuation service.

I sent the letter in and finally PayPal allowed me to return the item. Imagine that. I provided documentation that the item I received was worthless, and was required to send it back to the UK for my $7,450 refund. I called PayPal and talked to a representative asking about the best way to ensure I would get my money back and whether or not I would have to insure the item. She assured me that because I provided documentation that the item was valueless, I would not have to insure the item.

I went to the post office and sent the package back via registered mail, paying around $30. I updated the case with the proper information on the 9th, and have been checking every single day, awaiting its return.

As I was checking, I saw a little note on the claim that said "PayPal will contact you if further information is required by June 17th." I thought this was odd, since that date had already passed (it was around the 20th by then). So I called and was assured that everything would by fine, and that the date would automatically update to around July 7th to be checked for delivery.

Today, at 9:37PM, I received an email from PayPal saying that they CLOSED my claim. To me, this seems completely boundless and unreasonable. I called PayPal, unbelievably frustrated and horrified, and was informed that NO MATTER WHAT, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING IF THE MAIL COURIER TRUCK WERE TO EXPLODE WITH THE RETURN INSIDE, PayPal could not return my payment unless delivery receipt was confirmed.

I have filed an inquiry with USPS to track my registered mail. And now I am writing this, because I am at my wit's end. Please, for the love of God, tell me what I did wrong and what I can fix.

[Alexe123]

Oh dear apparently PayPal mobile doesn't allow for line breaks. Sorry readers!

[Alexe123]

SOMEBODY HELP ME

[kernowlass]

Was the item fake or just misdescribed? Because i am surprised that they have made you return a fake item assisting a seller in breaking the law in returning it to them !!!!!

I would query that one with them. Also don't give up, it sounds as if you should be protected and i would be well miffed as well if they found against me especially after saying return the item non trackable. Have you appealed the decision???

Finally did you fund your paypal payment with a credit card (please tell me that you did)?? If so then contact your card issuer and see if they will chargeback for you.

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[Alexe123]

Basically, the guy sent me a replica of a completely different release. The original demo copy record (which I purchased) had a white label. The commercial pressing had a red label. He sent me a replica of the commercial pressing. So not only do they look completely different, but what he sent me is just trash. And yes, here's the bad part. I paid $6,000 from my PayPal account. So only $1,450 would be recoverable from chargeback. And I'm not sure whether or not to file a chargeback because PayPal has a double recovery rule. I called PayPal and the guy basically told me I was completely wrong. I will look into appealing.

[kernowlass]

How can you be wrong?

Paypal found in your favour and told you to return the item to the seller non-trackable so you did as they advised !!!

Now I know they normally tell you to send it trackable but if you have been wrongly advised by one of THEIR customer service agents then how can that be your fault.

And if they say they have no proof of the phone call then i would tell them to check as most companies record all phone calls.

Also if paypal really do not refund you then of course you have the right to go to your c.c. company as it won't be double recovery as they have not sent you a refund.

I am often accused of defending paypal on here but to be honest their customer service agents are sometimes not the brightest lights in the harbour from what I read on here and I don't see why you should lose out on their very poor advice. 

         ********************************************

I give up my time to help you so a thank you or kudos would be cool.

Marking one of my replies as a solution would be appreciated if I sorted your problem.

[Alexe123]

Well, I was advised to not get it insured. I thought at the time maybe I should get a name, but I didn't and it's eating me. It was sent with tracking and via registered mail, though, sorry to confuse you about that. PayPal's terms say a signature is required, but my point is what on earth can I do if I did everything correctly on my end and USPS or Royal Mail just **bleep** up. Am I supposed to fly to the UK and hunt down the package myself if the inquiry doesn't find it? That's basically what I was told in short on the phone the other day. The thing is, I could've insured the package for $7,500, but it wasn't intrinsically valuable. That's why they told me not to insure it. USPS requires proof of value anyway, so it wouldn't make sense. But it would've solved an issue if that happened--of course that jerk in the UK would get a free $7,500. It doesn't seem like 'buyer protection' but some ridiculous technicality from PayPal. Like I said, it's so clear that I was scammed, and I proved that with official documentation from a record store. I had family members around when I opened the package even. The representative told me that this only allowed me the right to send it back. Which is just absurd, because it's no different from a return. I called Royal Mail today and spoke to a guy who said he would direct me to the international department, but it turns out they're closed until Monday. He told me it's likely just stuck somewhere. Best case scenario, it's just delayed and will be delivered soon enough to not worry about the chargeback deadline. I guess I should call PayPal and verify that it's alright to do that. And of course, get a name this time. It just got me thinking, what the **bleep** happens if he signs a fake signature or declines to accept the package. Technically then, PayPal wouldn't receive proper delivery confirmation, even though it's so logical. It just seems like PayPal is sticking to its technicalities instead of helping me. Is there any chance there's a way to talk to someone higher up in the chain of command?

[Alexe123]

That bleep was not an awful word, by the way 😞 But PayPal didn't technically find the case in my favor. They denied it after 'tracking was invalid.' But it's clearly not... It's just not delivered. I just can't understand how they can close the case when it's in the middle of delivery.

[kernowlass]

Expect they will bleep this as well then as i think that is bloody ridiculous, you have done all you could do and all that was asked of you..............sometimes wonder what planet these agents are on.

I am in the UK and you would not believe how many "signed for" items are just popped into my porch if I am out and sometimes the postie signs for it himself or its just unsigned for.

                   ****************************************

I give up my time to help you so a thank you or kudos would be cool.

Marking one of my replies as a solution would be appreciated if I sorted your problem.

[PayPal_Tricia]

Hi Alexe123,

I am sorry ot hear of the difficulites experienced with the Claim process.

If the return tracking does not confirm delivery back to the address that we have provided you with the claim will not be closed in your favor. We do have to confirm the item was returned back to the merchant as per our protection guidelines.

You do have the option to appeal the claim.

Please also feel free to reach out to us on Facebook or Twitter for account specific help.

I hope this information helps

Thanks,

Tricia