Refunding Postage Costs

[DoTheyEvenTry]

HI everyone,

 I have some speakers, which I bought on eBay, which have stopped working within six months.

I contacted PayPal, who have opened a dispute on my behalf.

I've been told that the seller may just refund me outright, or they may request that I post them back to them. The thing is, I live in England, and they live in the Netherlands. I phoned PayPal and, eventually, got through to Ellie who told me that PayPal would be able to cover the cost of postage, that she'd look after my dipute, and that if I had any questions then I could reply to the email she sent me. 

True to her word, she emailed me. I then realised that I wanted to know the exact amount that PayPal would offer in terms of reimbursement. She told me that PayPal would either refund me themselves, or pay for the postage back. Some research online showed me that this would only happen for upto £15. 

On 4th January, I replied to Ellie email. I got an 'undeliverable' back, and was told to send her a secure message. I sent a message off, and it was replied to by someone whose name I couldn't pronounce, who just sent a generic reply, and didn't answer my question at all. I replied to this, and was sent a further generic email back. 

I estimate that I've sent over 10 messages through the Secure Message Centre. Not one has been replied to by Ellie (despite her promise that it would be), every message I receive has been from someone different, not a single reply relates to the quesiton I asked, and my request that my query be escalated to a manager (and I've asked this twice) has been ignored. 

How on Earth am I meant to get through to the person who said that they're managing my dispute? 

[kernowlass]

@DoTheyEvenTry

Why do you need to keep contacting them?

Open a dispute and if you win then you will be asked to return the item at your own expense back to the seller.

Then if you have activated the below link BEFORE you made the transaction you then go and claim your postage refund.

https://www.paypal.com/uk/webapps/mpp/refunded-returns

[DoTheyEvenTry]

Because PayPal have offered to pay my postage costs! But it’s unclear how much they will pay. So I want to ask them how much they will pay, and have them answer that question. Also - I’d like to be able to ask PayPal a question, and have an answer provided. I don’t expect to have to send ten messages, each one to be replied by a different person, and no access to the person who is handling my dispute.

[kernowlass]

@DoTheyEvenTry

Most disputes are automatic, you don't have someone 'dealing' with it.

If you have activated the link before the transaction you can claim your refund, if you didn't then you won't.

[DoTheyEvenTry]

I was told that I’d be able to contact Ellie if I had any questions. I have a question. I haven’t been able to contact her, despite 10 requests. Every. Single. Reply to my messages has been a generic copy and pasted reply, which doesn’t relate to postage costs. Every. Single. Reply has been from someone different to the person before.

[kernowlass]

@DoTheyEvenTry

Whatever, good luck with that one then.

I have made about 6 disputes over 10 years and its all automatic, not sure why you feel you should have personal service?

[DoTheyEvenTry]

I mean no disrespect to you by this, but “Whatever, good luck with that one then”, seems very similar to the official response I’ve got (ten times) from PayPal’s official channel.

[DoTheyEvenTry]

I should have a personal service, because I spoke to a representative who offered me a personal service and she said I could contact her if I had any question. Also - depending on your definition of “personal service”; yes - I think I deserve someone to read my messages, and answer my question.

[DoTheyEvenTry]

OK - so, when I'm talking about poor email service, this is the sort of thing I mean:

Here's the message I received this morning, with my comments underlined.

Estimado SImon (Why on earth are they greeting me in Spanish? Why isn't my name correctly capitalised?)

Thank you for contacting PayPal Customer Support. My name is and I am happy to assist (Does s/he not have a name?)

you with (XXbriefly repeat the members situationXX) (Even the template doesn't use correct punctuation!)

Thank you for your inquiry regarding the dispute (XXPP-000-000-000) (That's not my dispute number.)

and the reason why you need to return the item at your own expense to the seller. (Again, I've been told that I only need to return it if the seller requests that, and that the case will be automatically closed if we don't hear anything back within ten days. It's been ten days. It has not been decided that I need to return the item.)

Please fax or upload the proof of shipment until the (agent to insert date) . (Who uses fax machines? What fax number should I send it to? Why didn't the agent insert the date? Also, if I'd have followed this instruction, I'd be out of pocket around £50, which is the postage cost for a huge box to the Netherlands. Also, my whole query was about how much of the postage would be refunded. I was originally told that they'd cover it, whereas online it states up to £15.)

1) If this was sent in error - fine. But they should have quickly sent another email.

2) If this was a 'one off', then fine. But this has been the standard of service I've received in over ten messages. Each message has been from a different person, so it's been impossible to form a dialogue.

3) I'm annoyed that Ellie clearly told me that if I needed to contact her, then I should reply to her email. I replied, and got an 'undeliverable' back, telling me to use secure messaging. I've sent over ten messages - each one has been as poor as the above, and each one has been from a different person. None of them have answered the specific question I had. Ellie has disappeared.

4) I would have called them to discuss this, but whenever I do, I learn about their "unforeseen" call volume. However - I don't think it's "unforeseen". I've "forseen" their high call volume before each phone call. In fact, I was told to wait in a queue for over an hour when I first attempted to open the dispute, and apparently nobody was able to call me back. 

5) This has really, really put me off using PayPal for anything more complex than a book. Next time, I'm using Barclaycard. I've opened 'disputes' with them before, and they've been handled well.

I cannot put into words how upset I am with PayPal.

[ozsubrosa]

Ellie, I suspect, is the only real human you have interacted with. I've had issues, gone on a descending spiral of unhelpful autoprompted "answers" (that don't) and then ended up with "live chat". Random-name-generated robot that responds to algorithms - I've had it before with other internet CS live chat help. So, I type ever more farcical scenarios of how Paypal is brilliantly going to resolve my problem and - instead of a real human response of "wha?" - Taliyaaana always replies "that's correct, rest assured that Paypal blah blah blah" after the algorithms have done their work. Throw in a ludicrous apology and Bethsheba will quickly soothe your brow and tell you that she lives only to solve valued customers problems.

It's pathetic and, eventually, you'll give up and hope that the system goes your way, which is a handy by-product of the cost-saving, human-free CS setup here. In fact, I'd better kick myself just to make sure that I really exist. Ouch.