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since ‎Jan-21-2011
BennyPendentes
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Re: Overdraft fee charge by Bank ... Credit Card w...

by BennyPendentes Contributor in Sending money (Archive)
‎Jan-21-2011 11:22 PM
‎Jan-21-2011 11:22 PM
I am currently in the middle of an economic travesty precipitated by this practice of Paypal's, which has a name that rhymes with "bait-and-switch".  They've done nothing wrong *legally*, this is just their way of coercing you into using their more profitble services... they are a business, after all, and this is one of the ways they make money.  You don't want to pay the bank fees, so you upgrade your Paypal account, maybe take out a Paypal credit card, and that problem goes away - a lot like the problem of having your business vandalized by the mob goes away if you start paying the mob 'protection' money.   Welcome to the machine. ... View more

"Fallback" apparently doesn't mean what I thought ...

by BennyPendentes Contributor in Sending money (Archive)
‎Jan-21-2011 11:06 PM
‎Jan-21-2011 11:06 PM
My account has, for years, been configured such that the primary source of funds is a bank account and the secondary is a credit card  When I made a recent purchase I read the usual notice: if the primary source was insufficient, Paypal would "fall back" to the secondary source for the balance.  As usual, I left this the way it was - there has never been a problem with this setup and I didn't expect any problems this time.   I checked my Paypal account and the transaction said the funds had been collected from the primary source (bank) and that the transaction was complete.  I went to my bank website, where I found that this wasn't true: the transfer had been denied due to insufficient funds.  No problem, I thought... that's exactly what secondary "fall-back" funding sources are for.  So I went to my credit card website, but strangely there had been no transaction there.   I returned to my Paypal account: it still said the transaction had been completed via withdrawal from the bank.  Returning to the bank website I found that the insufficient amount was even lower: I had been levied an "insufficient funds" charge of $30.  This was unpleasant, but since Paypal had discovered the first source to be insufficient I figured that they would now fall back to the secondary source.   Then I got an email from Paypal, informing me that they were not only *not* going to fall right back to the secondary source, they were going to wait three days and attempt to withdraw the funds from the bank again, which will trigger another $30 dollar "insufficient funds" charge and possibly affect my credit report in an undesirable manner.   I searched the website, found no mention of this practice.  (No, I'm not accusing Paypal of not sharing this information - I'm sure it's in the fine print somewhere, and that it is my fault for assuming that the words I'd read about fallback to secondary sources were defined according to standard English definitions and usage conventions.)  I searched the forums, and found just enough information to start getting worried.   So I called tech support.  They told me the standard practice is to check a second time after three days before moving on to the secondary source.  This process was unstoppable, and with arrival of the non-business-days weekend even getting the recipient to refund the payment (which might not even be possible - it was a time-sensitive and binding purchase) wouldn't clear up the situation before Paypal triggers another fee rather than moving on to my secondary source.   This is starting to feel like a car crash in slow-motion: I can see it coming, I can feel the dread and urgency, but I have no choice but to wait for the inevitable collision.   I've looked all over my Paypal account - I can't see a way to switch funding sources after a purchase has been made.  I can't delete the bank account or re-order the funding sources because I have an impending transaction, which ironically happens to be the very transaction that made me seek out such remedies in the first place.  I appear to have no option but to wait and watch Paypal inflict further depredations upon my anemic bank account while it ignores the credit card source that was added, so I thought, specifically to prevent situations like this one.   In the final analysis, I suppose I made some assumptions that, however logical, turned out to be incorrect.  In a moral and legal sense, Paypal has not violated any agreements or over-stepped the bounds of the working relationship I have with them.  I find that this fails to console me overmuch as I watch my bank account get flogged by a process that I thought was set up specifically to avoid such problems.  Looking at the big picture, the main product Paypal sells is convenience - no more mailing checks or purchasing money orders.  But if I had to place a dollar value on the convenience they have afforded me throughout my time as their customer, I would come up with a number that is less than the $60 this little experience has cost me.    - Benny ... View more

Re: Your bank declined your electronic funds trans...

by BennyPendentes Contributor in Sending money (Archive)
‎Jan-21-2011 07:01 PM
‎Jan-21-2011 07:01 PM
UPDATE: I spoke to customer support, who informed me that there is no way to stop Paypal from making a second attempt to withdraw funds from my bank account, thereby triggering a second $30 "insufficient funds" fee and doing who knows what kind of damage to my credit report, before falling back to my secondary funding source.  I can't delete the bank as a source because it has a pending transaction, which is the whole problem to begin with.  I know, the fact that Paypal doesn't just immediately fall back to the secondary source was probably in the fine print of some policy update, and my assumption that Paypal would behave sanely is my own problem, but truly?  The benefits I've received from having a Paypal account don't add up to the $60 Paypal just cost me.  I'm now paying more for the "privilege" of using the service than I'd have spent on gas and stamps not using it.  Thanks, Paypal!  And goodbye, as soon as my second "impending" punch in the nuts clears.   ===============================================   When I placed a recent order, Paypal clearly stated that if there were not sufficient funds in my primary funding source (bank), the transaction would fall back to my secondary source (card).  This is what it always says, and in the past I have never had a problem with it  - I place an order, and Paypal gets the funds from wherever they happen to be.   Or so I thought.   Today I got an email from Paypal saying:   "You recently attempted to transfer funds from your bank account.    Your bank has declined the funds transfer because your account did not have sufficient funds available. We will automatically re-attempt this transfer in 3 business days. Please fund your bank account immediately to ensure this transaction can be completed."   This... clearly isn't the same thing as "we will use your secondary funding source".  I have no intention of moving more money into the first source - based on these events I'm inclined to delete it entirely - but I am concerned about just how many times Paypal is going to ping my bank (possibly triggering NSF charges each time) before doing what it said it would do and falling back to my credit card.   Any advice on what I should do?  Due to health and mobility problems plus an aide that is on vacation I will not be going to my bank any time soon - sort of the reason I use Paypal the way I do.  I do not have options for putting more funds into the bank account until my next check is automatically deposited there, which is way longer than three days.  I do however have this lovely credit card with scads of money available, and since Paypal didn't do what they said they would do and fall back to my secondary funding source, I would like to somehow draw its attention to this card to keep Paypal from badgering my bank account when there is a nice juicy source of funds just right over here.   Who wants some credit card num nums?  That's a good Paypal... step away from the banking account, there's nothing there for you.  Come get a nice tasty credit card treat!  Who's a good Paypal?  Who's a good Paypal?  That's right, YOU are!  Good Paypal.  There you go.     - Benny Pendentes ... View more
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