Is it ok that PayPal can ban you for any reason, without anything you can do to resolve it?

Sarcasm83
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Last year, I found a 3d figure that looked fantastic being sold online and I figured that I really want to buy it.
I contacted the seller, got information about the figure and how I could pay for it in 2 parts, as it was a very expensive, custom made figure.
The seller suggested that I transfer the payment to him in two parts via paypal.
Having been a long time user of Paypal (near 2 decades), I knew PayPal has a great buyers protection service that will protect me even if this ended up to be a scam in some way. It felt trustworthy enough, but still, it was great to know they'd have my back.
After making the two payments, PayPal suddenly informed me that my account was limited. I logged in to find out that my account was permanently limited. A ban for forever.
For a while I was very confused on why and they only said that it was due to suspicious activity that they will "investigate" or whatever. I contacted them and they have at every point refused to answer what it was and keep telling me they don't have to state any reasons and don't have to provide any ways to resolve it, as they can remove anyone's access to their services at any given time, if they wish.

Since my transaction history had nothing else but PayPal checkout transactions on sites (that to my knowledge are always officially approved for those sites?) and that transfer to that seller, I realized the person's name.... was Russian. That's when I realized it was because they saw it as me aiding Russians or something. I contacted them again, gave them screenshots of our chats, the product page and what I was buying and one understanding customer support person even said they can "elevate it" to a higher level to be checked, but no... nothing has ever made them hear me out.
Right now I came back to the site as I have finally got the 3d printed figures, that I could send them the video of me doing the unboxing and showing very clearly the sellers name on the box, opening it and showing the contents to absolutely prove what I bought and what it was for, but I no longer can send them any kind of message.

The 3D figures themselves were not like in the pictures and it turned out that the person had used an officially factory produced figures marketing material when selling it. They are amateurish and home made, instead of the great quality that was shown in the pictures. So I would have even needed PayPal's customer/payers protection, but to protect me from something they deem suspicious, they banned me instead.

I had also just planned on setting up my own online store and using paypal as the checkout service, as I have finally started to find ways I could work from home, as my anxiety and constant unemployment due to therapy isn't allowing me to have a regular dayjob, despite all my efforts.
So safe to say this all came with a huge amount of depression, when none of this was in any way something I did wrong. I had no idea they could just throw me away like a piece of garbage for making one wrong payment to a person who just so happens to be from a country that they have a virtue signaling campaign against, as if all individuals from that country were involved in the world situation... 

So if nothing else, please always keep in mind who you are paying to, since - even if they aren't doing anything illegal and just selling some service - if their home country is something "controversial" PayPal won't hesitate to ban you forever no matter how many years of loyal user you've been without any kind of a violation.

I wish there still was some human at PayPal who could actually take it to their attention to look through this, as I would have all the evidence needed to provide the chatlogs, the seller's page, the unboxing that shows every single step of me opening and showing the contents...

I would want nothing more than to resolve this and never, ever intended to violate any user agreement in any way. A warning, or refused payment and a warning would have absolutely been enough.

What is also kinda annoying is that PayPal is also refusing to remove my account and information for the next 10 years. They will hope all my personal info, to make sure I won't try to make another account.

I feel really, truely worthless in their eyes and far from any kind of valued user. Sad that this whole thing ended in this.

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Sarcasm83
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Oh and luckily there was no funds at all on my account.. So I'm not thinking they've done it with the motive to rob me or anything. I even told them directly back in the first reply that I'd be glad to have actual government officials or the police to investigate this "suspicious activity" on my account, because I'm so certain I have no done anything wrong - and I'd still wish for that! I'd just want it resolved.... Oh well.
Was my last attempt and at least now I know nothing can ever help.
Time to accept it and shut up.
All glory to the great and flawless Paypal unaccountable overlords;
It's not a service, it is a right and I have, somehow, displeased em.
Just wish I'd known why or how.

Have a great week, stay safe everyone.

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kernowlass
Esteemed Advisor
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@Sarcasm83 

 

Nothing wrong with sending funds to a Russian person as long as they are not living in Russia as Russian paypal accounts can no longer receive paypal payments.

You would not have been banned just because someone had a Russian name otherwise everyone in the Ukraine / Lithuania / Lithuania etc wouldn't be able to use a paypal account.

 

So the ban would have been for another reason of which there are many and not just ''transaction'' related.

However Paypal do not give you an actual reason, I guess because it would not change things anyway even if you knew.

 

Secondly ''custom made'' goods are not covered by paypal buyer protection anyway. Paypal buyer protection is not a 100% coverall of everything so best to read up on it first to risk assess your sales.   


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Sarcasm83
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Well good to know, then it was even more on a whim for completely no reason whatsoever. At least I can then stop blaming myself for anything and that there could have never been anything I could've done.

The only transactions outside of that money transfer were paypal checkouts on online stores.
"Paypal do not give you an actual reason, I guess because it would not change things anyway even if you knew."
It would change a lot in my experience, as right now it feels like there is a complete lack of respect towards me. At least if they would - or somehow could reason what it was about, then I would not feel so depressed about it.

I did read every word and the line
"

  • Custom-made goods that are significantly not as described"
    while confusingly written, I thought meant that Custom-made goods that are not significantly different from how described. (Not protecting against non-significant differences... as that would make sense and why there'd be the addition of significance in that line. If it covered no custom-made goods of any kind, I don't think there'd be a need to say anything else than "Custom-made goods".

    Thank you for your reply, but I assure you this is 100% sincerely my experience with this and it's disheartening the only reply is a denial of that experience and a "you should've known better."

    I do not believe I deserved this...

    It's in my opinion quite a flaw in how things work, if users don't even know why they're suddenly just discarded or can't follow rules in a way that would prevent it, due to.... idk... not knowing what I could've ever done different. It's incredibly disheartening...
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kernowlass
Esteemed Advisor
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@Sarcasm83 

 

Paypal do not ban you on a 'whim'. 
Everyone who posts on here about being limited always says that they had broken no rules. However Paypal do not ban you for 0 reason. What would be the point? They make far more money from you using your Paypal account than interest on any held money.


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Sarcasm83
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I know what I have or haven't done and there has been no nefarious activity on my behalf, unless there has been an account breach and I've never seen anything like that in my sign-in logs or transactions.
The only other hunch apart from the "paid to a Russian" thing it could be, is having used a paypal checkout on buying a month membership once to an adult themed site, since they have some sort of a very vague clause about it violating their terms if things are "too obscene" or something.
Then again, if they provide such a site a paypal checkout and it's used against terms, I'd imagine it would be the seller at fault..? Why won't they disprove them from using paypal checkout? Just checked and they still have paypal checkout.

Either way, none of this helps me in any way if I try to lie about this, as I'd eagerly warn people to not make my mistakes, if I knew of mistakes or wrongs I did, but I simply do not. I can't think of anything that would warrant a lifetime ban like that.

So I suppose no matter how many people write it and how often, you will keep thinking they are all just lying? That there can be no way paypal would ever make a mistake, despite seeming their systems are automated? Well alright, that is your right. 
I just don't know what benefit there'd be to lie, but it is very convenient that they state no reasons, so they (and you) can keep on just insisting "rules were broken, your fault" and no resolve of any kind offered, even if there was a mistake or misunderstanding.

I'll say again, there is something truely broken if the system works in a way where, not only me, but several people are frequently writing about being limited forever without any warning and don't even know what they could've done to avoid it - and no resolves or reasons of any kind are stated.

You are very right that something like that would never benefit them in the long run. I could never recommend anything else but to keep far away from a service like this, as I can't imagine how anyone could rely their businesses on that, when they don't work with you in any way to communicate about something as severe as a no-warning-forever-ban that comes as a complete surprise.

If it wasn't about the russian seller, then I'm genuinely left even more baffled about this than before.
My paypal address isn't used or added to any platform and not known by anyone, so it can't be conduct, I have never sold anything. I've never talked on the forums, I'm always respectful to everyone and for years I just used paypal as a fast checkout and the only thing from the last decade that was a transfer was the Russian thing. I'm at a complete loss what it could possibly be. That's why this lingers on in my mind.. another bad thing on top of my anxiety and depression that I'm just blamed for and I have no idea what I've done! Feels horrible.

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Sarcasm83
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Oh and luckily there was no funds at all on my account.. So I'm not thinking they've done it with the motive to rob me or anything. I even told them directly back in the first reply that I'd be glad to have actual government officials or the police to investigate this "suspicious activity" on my account, because I'm so certain I have no done anything wrong - and I'd still wish for that! I'd just want it resolved.... Oh well.
Was my last attempt and at least now I know nothing can ever help.
Time to accept it and shut up.
All glory to the great and flawless Paypal unaccountable overlords;
It's not a service, it is a right and I have, somehow, displeased em.
Just wish I'd known why or how.

Have a great week, stay safe everyone.

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Sarcasm83
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Oh and they do at least reserve the right to remove you on a whim.

"Our decision to leave your account in a permanent limitation status is final.

PayPal reserves the right to limit access to any account reported to be involved in possible fraudulent or high risk behavior."

It doesn't have to be any factual or confirmed bad behavior, just "possible". If suspected - or REPORTED, it's enough to land you unfit forever. 

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Detdet231
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Member
How can I withdraw balance to Paypal if my acc is permanently limitations
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kernowlass
Esteemed Advisor
Esteemed Advisor

@Detdet231 


If you have been told your Paypal account has been permanently limited then Paypal tends to hold any funds for 180 days. This is the same time frame that buyers have to open Paypal disputes.

If no disputes are opened in 180 days then normally you are allowed to withdraw the funds. That is as long as you are over 18, account is in your legal name and the account is registered in the country where you reside.

Sometimes they confiscate funds under this policy.
https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full?locale.x=en_US#actions

Paypal also may request further documentation from you before you can withdraw those funds.




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