PayPal pending payment

socrcoach17
New Community Member

I would like to hear from someone at PayPal the answers to several specific questions relating to the pending payment policy. I have read the various threads on this, and the relevant section of the Terms of Service Agreement, but these are questions not answered elsewhere.

 

FIrst, the background. Like so many others here, I was caught by surprise when payment was held up for an item I sold on eBay. The item sold for $455 and because it is heavy and bulky, the shipping charge was $225 (in the actual fact, it cost me more than that amount to pack and ship and I ate the difference). The winning bidder paid immediately via PayPal. PayPal immediately marked this as a "pending" payment. The item was shipped less than 48 hours after the auction closed and delivered yesterday. I supplied the tracking information to PayPal/eBay as instructed. The payment still shows simply as "pending" and when I click on "Details" I am told that status applies for another 14 days, OR 3 days after PayPal can determine that the item was delivered, OR 3 days after the buyer leaves positive feedback.

 

There is no way for me to verify that PayPal/eBay knows now that the item was, in fact, delivered yesterday. There is no way to know when and if a change in pending status has occurred. The policy is ambiguous as to whether delivery even matters for an eBay auction item, or if only positive buyer feedback will release the funds in less than 21 days.

 

QUESTION 1: If the item was sold pursuant to an eBay auction, is the pending status changed when the SOONER OF or LATER OF the two listed events occur: provable delivery or positive buyer feedback? How can I verify that PayPal now knows the item was delivered and, therefore, that the 3-day clock has started to count down?

 

PayPal positions itself as the most convenient way for a seller to accept payments, especially on eBay transactions. I was charged a $20+ fee for this transaction. I had to front the $225 shipping charge. I now have to wait an arbitrary amount of time for payment, with no feedback from PayPal as to status before or after the buyer submitted his PayPal payment transaction. In the very best case, the funds will hit my bank account two weeks from when the auction closed because of the holiday weekend.

 

QUESTION 2: Why is this good for me as a seller? You are charging me premium transaction fees, what service am I AS A SELLER getting in return for this policy and the fees charged?

 

The most basic tenet of contract law is that the parties have to agree to the terms in order for there to be a contract. PayPal's Terms of Service Agreement relating to pending payments is hopelessly vague, to the degree that I question that it constitutes a contract. It would not be a valid contract for me to say, for example, "I can do whatever I want for any reason" and for you to agree, and for me to then take your car and your house. I could argue that your agreement was stupidity on your part (which is, essentially, PayPal's response to sellers in the various threads and is vaguely insulting), but I could not defend such capricious actions in court based on that "contract." Particularly in a dependent situation like this

 

The PayPal pending payment policy does not, for example, let me know, as a seller, whether I or any given transaction are subject to being pended, what I can do to prevent it, or what specific criteria PayPal will use. PayPal relies on terms like "high risk" that clearly mean something very different to the sellers who have spoken out in this forum than they mean to PayPal. In no way would I, as a reasonable seller, read the text of the TOSA and interpret it as meaning what PayPal is, in fact, doing. You are doing things that are not reasonable interpretations that a reasonable seller would be expected to conclude are consistent with the TOSA's language. They appear to be arbitrary and capricious and unrelated to the stated policy.

 

In short, a seller "agreeing" to the TOSA can have no basis for understanding what it now turns out PayPal means by those words.

 

QUESTION 3: How does the TOSA, regarding pending payment holds, constitute a valid contract, given that you provide no way for the seller to know what he/she is agreeing to and that reasonable sellers clearly think you are interpreting this language in ways opposite to the way they understand it?

 

Given that PayPal relies on its "sole discretion," there is an implied obligation for the policy and its enforcement to rationally relate to its purpose.

 

As with so many others, there is no evidence in my case of any kind of a problem. This was a personal sale, but I own a company that accepts credit cards based in large part on my own credit history, and have had no problem with approvals for those transactions from banks, or any problems with any specific transactions. There is no history of complaints against me personally or my company, I have no criminal history, no financial fraud, solid credit rating, bank account has been verified. In other words, PayPal has reached a decision about my "risk" that is opposite what other financial institutions that provide similar services have concluded.

 

QUESTION 4: How does the pending payment discretion policy of PayPal rationally relate to actual risks to buyers, its putative purpose? What does the term "high likelihood" mean anyway - 50%? 10%? 1%? What statistical evidence does PayPal have that the criteria used are predictive of a "high likelihood" (whatever that means) of buyer dissatisfaction? Is there any such evidence at all that eBay frequency is a reliable predictor, or is this just someone's guess?

 

Clearly, this policy benefits PayPal financially. You get the benefit of interest on the funds while they are in pending status. It is like travellers checks - the financial institution makes money on the float. Therefore, PayPal has set itself up with a clear conflict of interest, between fairly interpreting ambiguous or discretionary sections of the TOSA, e.g., what constitutes "risk" to buyers, and what is financially beneficial for PayPal.

 

QUESTION 5: Will PayPal remove this conflict by paying interest on the funds held? If not, how can you claim to not have an egregious conflict of interest in your unilateral interpretation of the TOSA?

 

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489 REPLIES 489

Amanda411
Moderator
Moderator

Hi All,

 

I realize that this can be frustrating however, I just want to clarify that funds can be released before 21 days. To learn more see here:

 

https://www.paypal.com/paymentholds

 

This policy helps buyers feel more confident in a successful transaction and helps to manage costs effectively for everyone.

 

Amanda

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shawnhensontn
Contributor
Contributor

ok i have a item that was deliverd to my customer yesterday. AM I SUPPOSED to rely on them to notify you that i delivered what they paid for?

 

ITS BETTER to drop paypal and do everything C.O.D. if this is how paypal want to do business with us.  you taking fees out for each item we sell (which paypal is part of Ebay ) and ebay ttakes fees out too.

 

I have sent a email to paypal about shipping confirmation  but what i get back is a CANNED response saying for me to call  .  the awesome messaging system there at paypal  thinks i asked about my account billing.

go figure.. a great way to postpone the funds.

 

If things dont change within today  im going to have to cancel my ebay store  (which im paying 49.95  (stupid i know) but was worth a shot at trying to run a business.

 

thank you paypal.

 

When i have bought items within this past week  my funds was never held from the seller. I checked i emailed the sellers and explained to them.  they checked and wow  the funds was not held from them.. what gives

 

it shurely didnt make me feel   how did u say it  oh yea  "

This policy helps buyers feel more confident in a successful transaction and helps to manage costs effectively for everyone.

"  confident....

 

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shawnhensontn
Contributor
Contributor

I’m a new seller. Will payments I receive be held?

If you’re a new seller with PayPal, we may hold your payments until you establish payments history and a record of good performance.

 

my paypal account is setup for all sales  and shipping   cant chip if there is no funds to pay for it...  \

 

nice catch 22 paypal.

 

I only linked my bank to ge back the verification   NOT TO FUND SHIPPING.

 

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pinkdiamond
Member
Member

drahomir
Contributor
Contributor

I had sold a product to one person twice late last year. Although I had to sen a reminder for payment for the first item, I received cleared funds right away. I shipped and left positive feedback right away for the two items, no feedback was left for me by the buyer. Same buyer purchased same item and I received immediate payment with 21 day hold! I clearly state in my listings that item will be shipped within 2 business days of cleared Paypal payment. No I just sold same item to a foreign buyer with a Private Feedback Profile, received immediate payment with the 21 day Paypal hold. Although Paypal will release funds when Positive Feedback is left, I worry that feedback will not be left, or buyer might take his sweet time about leaving feedback (which first buyer took 5 days after delivery. My quandary to ship, wait for funds, ask buyer to see his Private Feedback before doing anything??? Please give advise!!

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bizmom74
Member
Member

OK I CAN SEE ALOT OF PEOPLE ARE HAVING THE SAME PROBLEM I AM. HERE IS THE KICKER FOR ME, I WORK WITH A DROPSHIPPER WHICH MEANS I GET THE PAYMENT FROM THE CUSTOMER AND THEN SEND THE MONEY TO MY SUPPLIER AND THEY SHIP THE PRODUCT. HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO RUN MY BUSINESS AND GET POSITIVE FEEDBACK WHEN PAYPAL IS HOLDING THE MONEY I NEED TO SEND TO MY DROPSHIPPER. IM DOING THIS TO MAKE MONEY WHICH MEANS I DONT HAVE ANY YET!!!!!!!! SO HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO PAY FOR THESE ITEMS UNTIL PAYPAL SEES FIT TO GIVE ME MY MONEY.......THIS IS BOLOGNA

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spartan55
New Community Member

it **bleep** that we all have the same problem.ive been waiting almost a month and a half for $114.it hit my paypal saying pending,they took there fees right away $4.89.and i still dont have anything!!!! my customer had just open a paypal account just so he could buy my item and now a month and a half later he's p#ssed at me and im p*ssed at paypal...they even say dont ship your items untile it is no longer pending.i have 100% feedback "so far" so why not give me my money.

 

i say tell everyone to post something on here till we can get some issues fixed!!!

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spartan55
New Community Member

and i geuss paypal say i cant use the word "**bleep**'s"only  **bleep**

 

thanks again paypal!!!

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joseph28
Contributor
Contributor

I've got close to 1200 in paypal for six months now.  I don't think I will ever get this money back. Did anyone have a a rolling reserve that was later released?

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rgt1
Contributor
Contributor

Do you people actually think PayPal gives 2 hoots about this forum?

You are wasting your time on here.  The only way to beat this illegality is to  stop using PayPal as a selling service.

PayPal does not monitor this forum.

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