New Sellers and Hold Policy

[Disenchanted]

As I must await the release of funds from PayBay at some arbitrary point in time in the future (i.e.: return ownership to me), I am going to use the time to offer observations on their policies which may be of benefit to new sellers. Looks like I 'may' be here up to 21 days. Stop back often!

Specifically to the 21 day hold policy from PayBay

Word of the day: Unconscionability 

The hold policy is, obviously, a contract of adhesion.

Further, it uses the language "may" when in fact it should inform new/infrequent sellers that funds WILL be held and may be held up to 21 days no matter what you do. It should be clear as to this burden.

The policy seems at best misleading. 

So does it go to the point of deception? Does it matter?

But...the policy on releasing funds three days after verified delivery uses the term "may" when it probably should read PayBay will most likely not release your funds 3 days after verified delivery...at least not unless you have the time to waste to pester them. The incongruency of the term's use is striking.

To deprive a seller of both an asset and the proceeds of that asset is an extraordinary event for any length of time. The seller needs a clear and transparent warning up front before initiating sales. The agreement appears to reach well beyond being misleading considering its burden.

Holding an asset AND the proceeds of an asset for 21 days is ... astounding. 

Would it be found unconscionable?

So...what would a regulatory body/court say about a contract of cohesion...misleading at best, deceptive at worst...containing extraordinarily burdensome mandates...drafted by a behemoth (PayBay) for us common folk?

Unconscionable? [By the way...how did the PP/EB thing pass conflict of interest/antitrust smell tests?]

Is the clause enforceable if challenged?

I can't believe it has passed muster up to now! At the least, PayBay  should be forced to make this clause completely transparent...bold type...explanation of the burden of held funds.

Even then...21 days of free use of an enormous pile of money (certainly PayBay knows the exact average of this "held funds fund" for investment purposes) seems to over-reach to me.

Just thoughts for the day!

[Disenchanted]

...and of course the hold policy makes the statement that "the money belongs to you...." 

More misleading language? Deception?

It most definitely does not conform to the definition of ownership. In fact, the operation of the policy more accurately indicates PayBay has ownership during any hold period. 

What, do you think, the phrase "the money belongs to you" means if you have no dominion or control over it?

It does NOT mean what you think it says.

It MAY mean it MIGHT belong to you at some future time.

At the same time...the asset DEFINITELY has changed hands.

Just idle banter.

[Disenchanted]

If I were doing my homework prior to becoming a new seller, I would come across the following PayPal information:

https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=xpt/Marketing/securitycenter/sell/FundsAvailabilityPolicy-...

For those not wishing to link out...the first sentence on the web page regarding funds availability to sellers states: Generally, we will make funds that you receive available to you immediately.

If all new sellers are subject to held funds, this statement is inaccurate at best.

Just idle banter.

[Disenchanted]

The 'questionable' language of the hold policy notwithstanding, it is useful to step back a bit to its nexus.

Every time you open ebay you'll see Mr. Donahoe and his statement: "...we still believe ... people are basically good."

Sounds like a presumption that people are good. No?

Yet all new sellers are presumed bad by policy and will ["may"] be subject to the hold policy until they break that presumption. So what is his actual feeling about people generally? You have to prove you're not 'bad' to him? He really shouldn't give lip service to something his policies disprove.

He goes on further to tout ebay's buyer protection.

As a recent new seller, I have underwritten every bit of protection for my buyers with forced held funds. I've shipped expediently at additional expense. On my facts he's adding nothing...except...I suppose he is promising he can permanently hold my funds should the 'good' buyer convince him so.

Idle banter!