UPS and Not As Described disputes

kkootenay
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor

A (US) seller agrees to ship to Canada by USPS/CanadaPost, and then, finding that it is cheaper for him to ship by UPS Ground, because UPS will pick up at his house and includes Delivery Confirmation automatically, an expensive service with USPS.

 

The Canadian buyer, who expected to pay the Canada Post $5 service charge plus sales tax, is faced on the doorstep with a $25 "customs brokerage charge" from the UPS driver.

 

If the US seller will not refund all or part of the customs brokerage fee, can the Canadian buyer open and win a Not As Described dispute on the basis that the shipping service was changed without his knowledge and that this cost him $20 more than agreed?

 

Can PP force a partial refund on this basis, without return of the product?

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11 REPLIES 11

PayPal_Adrian
PayPal Employee
PayPal Employee

Welcome to the Canadian Boards!  It's good to have you here!

 

When PayPal reviews these claims, there are a number of factors that must be taken into consideration.  Customs fees are generally considered the responsibility of the recipient - whether it is a buyer receiving the item or a seller receiving a return.  As such, we are generally unable to grant these claims in the favor of the buyer.  However, we do take each claim on a case by case basis.

 

Given this type of situation, I would think that any buyer would be upset to be surprised with this kind of charge - especially when most of us are excited to finally get that package!  Instead, I would recommend working with the seller as much as possible.  Most sellers are absolutely wonderful merchants who are completely understanding of this sort of "sticker shock," so to speak.  The best place to start is with that same merchant.

 

If I were advising the merchant, I would recommend working with the buyer as much as possible.  If a claim later turns into a credit card chargeback or a bank reversal, the seller would be in a hard position to defend themselves.  It's always better to work with a buyer sooner than have to go through a claims process later.  Smiley Happy

 

Hope this helps,

 

Adrian

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autumn
Contributor
Contributor

 Hi Adrian,

 

If the buyer in this situation had refused to accept the package and to pay the extra fees that UPS charges, the package

would go back to the seller. Would the buyer then be able to open (and likely win)  a claim for an item not received?

 

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PayPal_Adrian
PayPal Employee
PayPal Employee

Autumn,

 

Customs fees are generally considered the responsibility of the recipient - whether it is a buyer receiving the item or a seller receiving a return.  As such, we are generally unable to grant these claims in the favor of the buyer if it is clear the buyer refused the item due to customs fees.  However, we do take each claim on a case by case basis.  Again, I would encourage the buyer and seller to work together as much as possible to resolve the issue to avoid a dispute, claim, or chargeback.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Adrian

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autumn
Contributor
Contributor

Thanks Adrian.

 

I understand that the buyer is responsible for duty and taxes. If the seller states that they are using USPS to ship an item, doesn't the buyer have a reasonable expectation to pay the amounts (tax, duty, $5 processing fee) associated with that particular shipping service? If the seller has changed the shipping method and by doing that the buyer now has an extra $25+ in fees, should that be the buyer's responsibility?

 

If the buyer accepts the item and pays those fees, I realize that there is not much that paypal can do. But if the buyer does not accept the package, the package is sent back to the seller. If the buyer then filed for an item not received, would paypal actually decline the claim even though the buyer does not have the merchandise?

 

I understand your recommendation about working with the seller but  there are times when a buyer doesn't realize that the seller has changed the shipping method until UPS shows up at the door asking for extra money. At that point, the buyer has no way of knowing if the seller will be willing to work with them and help with the fees. Are you saying the buyer should just accept the package, pay the fees and hope for the best?

 

I do realize that in most cases the seller isn't aware that their actions would result in an extra cost to the buyer but it was their actions that caused the extra cost (by changing shipping methods) so ultimately , they should be responsible imo.

 

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autumn
Contributor
Contributor

hmm , I will try asking again.

 

Adrian or Olivia,

 

. If the seller states that they are using USPS to ship an item, doesn't the buyer have a reasonable expectation to pay the amounts (tax, duty, $5 processing fee) associated with that particular shipping service?

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PayPal_Olivia
Moderator
Moderator

Hi autumn,

 

You're right, a buyer receiving international purchases should be informed of any customs fees for an incoming package. The reality is that a casual buyer may not be aware, and as a result may bounce the package back to the seller. 

 

The best way to avoid this is to make sure you're communicating with your buyers. A lot of these mistakes are made because the buyer has never encountered the situation before, and information at the right time can go a long way toward preventing inconvenience and financial loss.

 

I hope this helps!

 

Olivia

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utopiaglass
Contributor
Contributor

Olivia and Adrian,

 

Many eBay buyers know to avoid having items sent UPS because of the huge brokerage fees they can get dinged for so they would only purchase an item if they knew it was being shipped by USPS. 

 

I think the questions here are, firstly, if the buyer made the purchased based on the understanding that it was being shipped by USPS, in which case they knew what to expect by way of duty/taxes, etc., but the parcel arrived by UPS resulting in them having to pay excessive fees, can the buyer file for an item not as described? 

 

The buyer bought based on the representation the parcel was being sent by one method, but then the seller switched the method without the consent of the buyer resulting in excessive fees.  It does not seem fair that because the seller changed shipping methods without the consent of the buyer that the buyer should be stuck with additional cost.  Keep in mind the buyer would not have bought if they knew the seller was going to switch the shipping method. 

 

Secondly, if the scenario is as set out as above, does the buyer refuse the package or accept it then add the excessive costs at the time of receipt to the claim?

 

I may just be repeating what previous posters have said, but I'm having a hard time accepting that the buyer should just pay and live with it, despite him taking precautions at the time of purchase to avoid those fees.

 

Thanks!

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PayPal_Adrian
PayPal Employee
PayPal Employee

Everyone,

 

Thank you all for responding to this thread.  I apologize if my posts haven't been as clear as you would like - because each claim is unique, it's difficult to advise the best route without a specific claim to reference.  A unique claim can warrant a non-standard resolution, and I wouldn't want to give you the impression that PayPal isn't open to reviewing those claims or that the process is automated and set in stone. 

 

Our recommendations also only applies to the PayPal claims process - if filing directly through eBay (this may be an option depending on the eBay site you purchase from), you would want to query eBay separately.  With your permission, I'd like to delve a little deeper into the claims process and how these decisions are generally made.

 

First, if the claims process does have to be entered into, after your attempts at negotation with the seller fail, the type of case to file depends on who has the package and where the package is currently located.  If you haven't made a decision on whether or not to refuse the item, I would strongly encourage you to review the two scenarios below and decide accordingly as soon as possible - to refuse the package or to pay the brokerage fees.

 

If the buyer doesn't have the package and has refused it (and the online tracking has updated to show the refusal), he or she should file a claim for Non-Receipt.  In this scenario, the buyer would likely receive a refund.  Do not file a Non-Receipt claim if the item is still in customs waiting for you to accept it or you have already accepted it.  If you have refused the package and the shipping company has not updated the tracking within a reasonable amount of time, give a call to the shipper and ask them to please update the tracking for your parcel. 

 

If, as a buyer, you have chosen to accept the additional brokerage fees and now have the item, you could file a claim for Significantly Not as Described.  However, because customs fees are generally considered to be the duty of the recipient, and as a buyer because you have accepted such fees by paying them, these claims generally cannot be found in the favor of the buyer and no refund would normally be issued. 

 

The claims process will, however, allow you to formally register your grievance against the seller with PayPal (this becomes part of their permanent account history), and could bring the matter to a head where previous negotiations failed.  It could also allow you to formally negotiate a partial refund with the seller. 

 

If you're a seller in the above scenarios, I would encourage you to communicate openly with the buyer before changing shipping companies to avoid a negative experience for everyone involved.  If there is a later misunderstanding, it's always best to work out an agreement with the buyer whenever possible.  A happy customer is a repeat customer!

 

So, to summarize, if you refuse the item, you'll likely receive a refund in a claim.  If you accepted the item, you likely will not receive a refund through the claim.  If you haven't yet done one or the other, do so before filing a claim.  Even if you are not likely to receive a refund, a claim will still give you another chance to negotiate with the seller.

 

I hope this helps to clear everything up, and again, my apologies for any misunderstandings.

 

Adrian

 

 

 

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autumn
Contributor
Contributor

Thank you Adrian, I appreciate the response and it does make things more clear.

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