Is this a scam?

[J352SAURUS]

Hi everyone. I'm new here on the forum so I'm really sorry if I'm breaking any rules or if I put this post in the wrong spot! I'm in Australia. I don't know if that shows on my post or not. I'd really appreciate your help ASAP. I have a lot of conflicting evidence and I don't know if this is a scam or not. 

I listed a laptop for sale on Gumtree today. Less than an hour later some guy texted me saying he wants to buy it, and to email him on [his email address] with the present condition and firm price. That was a bit of a red flag since both the price and condition was on the ad. I emailed him anyway. He agreed to the price and said he wanted to buy it as a gift for his daughter in the USA. He said he'd check it out or pick it up himself but he's not available right not as he's away for weeks working on the rig, but he said he'd gladly pay for postage. Faint sounds of alarm bells but I push on. He told me to use the Australia Post website to calculate postage charges to the USA using express 4-day delivery so he knows how much he should pay in postage so I do and I tell him how much. He says he can pay me either by PayPal or by a bank transfer. He says his PayPal account can transfer to either PayPal or another bank account without any issues. Now, I have a PayPal account but I barely use it, so I don't know if that's even possible. PayPal has been a hassle in the past so I cautiously opt for a bank transfer and I provide my details. Then he tells me that he's going to send it to his cousin to receive it on behalf of his daughter, and he gives me the full name and full address of his cousin. I search for the house on Google Maps and it's a legit house, but that doesn't really mean anything. Alarm bells are getting louder. He says he'll keep me informed about when he makes the payment. Not long after, he emails me to say he's made the payment, and it's exactly the amount we agreed plus the exact amount of shipping I calculated. He says:

"I have just made the payment few minutes ago of $682.87 AUD (including the $82.87 for the shipping cost via Australia Express mail (EMS)). I believe PayPal should have messaged your email address to this effect and what needs to be done in regards to their new security policy to finalise the transfer. Please check your email box for their Confirmation mail, I have received an email from PayPal that the funds have been deducted from my account and it will be credited into your account once you advise them with the shipment tracking number. Find attached herewith, my proof of payment. Kindly confirm this and help me get it shipped tomorrow morning."

He attached a screenshot of his own confirmation email from his own email account in Google Chrome, including URL and browser bar, which said:

--

Hello [his first and last name]
[his email address]

This email confirms that your Instant payment of $682.87 AUD to [my first and last name] via PayPal Merchandise Wire Transfer Service has been successfully completed.

Reversals: This method of payment cannot be reversed.

Status: on Hold.

This PayPal® payment has been deducted from your PayPal account [his first and last name] and "APPROVED" immediately but will not be credited to the account of [my first and last name] until the shipment confirmation number is received from the recipient for shipment verification so as to secure both the buyer and the seller.

PLEASE NOTE:

Once the shipment is confirmed, the funds will become operational in the account of [my first and last name] and you will receive a "CONFIRMATION" email from Merchant Portal PayPal Payment Services.

Thank you for using PayPal.
PayPal Email ID PP1465

--

He wants me to send him a picture of the packed laptop before I send it, and he also wants a picture of the receipt once I send it. The email that I received went straight to my spam folder and this is what it said:

--

Hello [my first and last name],

This email confirms that you have received an Instant payment of $682.87AUD from [his first and last name] via PayPal Merchandise Wire transfer Service.

Reversals: This method of payment cannot be reversed.
Status: on Hold.

Beneficiary Account Details:
Bank: [my bank name]
Account Holder: [my first and last name]
BSB: [my BSB number]
ACCOUNT #: [my account number]

Send the Tracking # to us by replying directly to this email message.

This PayPal® payment has been deducted from the buyer's PayPal account [his first and last name] and "APPROVED" but will not be credited to your account until the shipment confirmation number is sent to us for shipment verification so as to secure both the buyer and the seller.

PLEASE NOTE
Once the shipment is confirmed, The funds will become operational in your account and you will receive a "CONFIRMATION" email from Merchant Portal PayPal Payment Services informing you that your account has been credited.

Thank you for using PayPal.
PayPal Email ID PP1465.

--

The email address that I used to email him is not the email address that I use for my PayPal. When I brought up my concerns that Australia Post seems to prohibit the sending of devices with lithium batteries installed, he said he was aware of that but he was sure that they will send it and "when you get there and they mention it (if they do), just tell them to send it anyways, it will get delivered without any issues". Not too sure about that... but yeah, all sorts of alarm bells are blaring in my mind. Is this a scam? Certainly many elements of this situation fit into common PayPal scams but not all of them do, which is why I'm confused. I'm inclined to say this guy is shady, but I don't know. Something doesn't feel right, but some things do. Have I done the wrong thing? I'm supposed to be sending the package in the morning but I don't know if I should. Please help!

[kernowlass · Accepted solution]

@J352SAURUS

Firstly you would never have paypal seller protection if you didn't send to the paypal registered address of the buyer.

Secondly your best bet is to read up on paypal seller protection so you are better equipped to risk assess them.

Having said that you have very good instincts 

SCAM.

They encourage you to accept a 'direct' Paypal payment and may ask you to send the item internationally.
No funds or activity of the transaction shows in your Paypal account and any emails 'may' go into your junk or spam folders.

You will get/got a "fake" email that looks as though it is from paypal.....it isn't because they don't actually have a Paypal account and have no intention of paying you.
It will say the buyer has paid ...you won't have been paid.
They will tell you that the payment is released when you provide paypal with a tracking/shipping number......this won't happen.

Paypal NEVER tell you to send an item before the payment is showing in your paypal account.
Paypal do not tell you to send trackable, they advise it for selling protection but it is not compulsory.
Delete any emails and ignore the scammers.

[J352SAURUS]

@kernowlass

Thank you so much! I can't tell you how much I appreciate your help! And, for that matter, how much it's eased my nerves! I'm not very experienced with this whole thing, so I wasn't sure if it was normal or not, but something definitely didn't feel right. Thank you.

Should I tell this guy I'm backing out and then delete the emails and block him? Or should I just block him? Do I need to tell PayPal?

Also, did I do the wrong thing by providing my BSB and account number? Am I in danger? I've long considered providing those details to be relatively safe, but nowadays you just don't know.

[kernowlass]

@J352SAURUS

Send one brief message politely saying you have sold elsewhere and then ignore and block.

Don't be tempted to give him a mouthful as they have been known to add emails to some nasty sites !!

However if they know you are not going to be a victim they won't waste anymore time on you and move on to the next potential victim.

However you should never have given them any bank account information as if they were using Paypal they do not need it.

I would keep a close eye on your bank account AND inform your bank account what has happened so that they can monitor it as well, but if they only have your account number then I don't think they can do much as that number used to be on cheques that you wrote and on cards when you pay.

So glad you were not caught out 

[J352SAURUS]

@kernowlass

Okay! Will do! Thank you! Haha, okay. I won't say anything nasty. The audacity of these people though! Wow!

Yes, I agree. That was a mistake and it was a silly thing to do. I guess that's where my inexperience (and limited knowledge about this stuff) comes into play, coupled with the fact that he said he could use PayPal to pay me via PayPal or via a bank transfer. I was also excited to sell the laptop because I do need the money so I suppose I was a bit blinded. It was a close call but I have learned my lesson!

Yeah, I only gave him my BSB and account number so probably nothing will become of it, but I'll keep an eye on things just in case.

Thanks again for your help. I truly appreciate it.

[becx]

I have just been in the same situation as above. Being new to all this and a bit gullible I gave my bsb and account number. I recieved the same email as above about payment being approved but won't be in my account until tracking number is sent. I am so glad I followed my instincts and googled PayPal scams, leading me to this community page. I have replied politely saying we no longer wish to go through with the sale and have deleted emails. I have however received another email from the person, do I just delete and ignore?

[kernowlass]

@becx 

Yes, once they know you are not going to be scammed they will move on to the next potential victim.

[mrsbeez]

Address:<removed>:Miami State:Florida Zip code:<removed>that’s the shipping information that they will tell you to ship to. i’ve had three people try and scam me to get me to send the item i’m selling. saying they sent money. got two emails just like the one that’s talked about above. if it’s not in your paypal account activity, it’s most likely a spam.

[Hswarrior87]

I got that this morning with miami and florida with a zip code hmmmmm