You are viewing the PayPal Community Archives. This content may be old or outdated. Leave the Archive
Chat with our moderator team every Wednesday between 1-2pm PT (4-5pm ET). Learn more in Community Events
This is the first I've ever had to deal with a dispute of this nature and so I'm just baffled as to how this is even possible. My international buyer filed a dispute today falsely stating that the items that he purchased from me were significantly not as described, but the tracking information for his purchase indicates that the items haven't even been delivered yet. I immediately escalated his dispute to a claim as it was obvious to me that he was simply trying to scam me out of my money - perhaps he thought that by placing a fraudulent dispute he could somehow get his money back AND brand new, perfect condition items for free? Maybe he was hoping that I'd just naively accept a return and then he'd send me an empty box? Actually, how can he even return something that hasn't even been delivered to him yet in the first place? My question for community is, can he even file a dispute for "significantly not as described" if he hasn't even received the items yet? He claims to have received used and damaged goods even though perfect and brand new items were sent. And, again, he's claiming to have received these used and damaged goods from me when the tracking information clearly shows that the items are still with customs and haven't even been cleared and subsequently sent out for delivery yet. How can you claim "significantly not as described" when the items haven't even been delivered yet? Again, I'm utterly baffled by this and am hoping that PayPal sees right through this scammer's attempt at fraud and shuts him down. Does he even have a case here?
No doubt a scam!
And Paypal has probably already deducted the funds from your account right?
Sadly EBAY and PayPal are scam magnets and the evil scammer geniuses want everything from our merchandise to our identity. Unfortunately, I have been victimized and have made the mistake of refunding one or more scammers AND THEY NEVER RETURNED MY MERCHANDISE. Now, I send the transactions to firstname.lastname@example.org for verification with any hint of suspicion.
I have a current situation however unfortunately where spoof has not helped me. I offer on site (in person) national fitness training and certification workshops. They buyers for years have gone to my site, followed the simple steps to download the registration form, brochure, and course outline, to contact me to set up the onsite training and then purchase the course text at my site via Paypal.
I received a payment from an email that did not have a name but rather, a title. I went to his site to check and again, no name, it looked bogus. And more suspicious was the fact that my last workshop was done and completed one month before this buyer even ordered. I wanted to refund but, spoof had not replied and I did not want to risk being hacked again. The buyer has ordered something that does not exist at my site. The buyer did not reply to my emails. spoof@paypal replied about TWO WEEKS later with only a note saying that they were looking into it. This past week Paypal sent me a warning of dispute. I went to the Paypal online resolution center and sent several emails since, to communicate with the buyer and still no reply. I have sent emails to Paypal and still, no reply from them either other than the continued dispute warnings that they are sending to my email inbox???
I think that PayPal should have a better handle on these disputes whether they are scams or not by communicating with us. It appears that you have not received guidance and resolution from them either in your situation and so, I guess I am not the only one. If Paypal cannot verify scams but, can serve us disputes based on the scammers bogus claims then we are in surely in need of divine intervention.
All the best, Shudokan
Yikes, shudokan! I'm not sure why PayPal would even PERMIT a dispute for a payment that you had notified them about from the get-go and had suspected was fraudulent from the very beginning. Why should you, as an honest and hardworking seller, be punished for spoof taking too long to "look into" things? And have your funds deducted and your account flagged when you wanted to refund the scammer's payment anyway and were simply taking precautions and proceding according to proper protocol? Ludicrous. It's almost like you have to instantly refund every single even-slightly-suspicious payment that comes your way and just hope for the best? Is that any way for a seller to do business? How many legitimate payments would you have to potentially lose out on just to maintain this "best offense is a good defense" type strategy? You'd be losing time and money just to prevent yourself from getting scammed and/or hacked when that protection ought to be PayPal's responsibilty, not yours. I'm at a loss here. When a buyer files a dispute, especially one that's fishy from the get-go, why can't PayPal just freeze the buyer's funds initially and not the seller's? That way the seller can at least continue to do business with their regular, legit customers and not have to have their account restricted, etc. while the resolution center is taking its time leaving you in the dark and not much else. And then perhaps they should only deduct the money from the seller once an actual return has been approved AND shown without a doubt to have physically arrived back to the seller. I can't believe you've had to refund merchandise that never got back to you. That's double the losses you've had to suffer plus all of the time, energy, and frustration of having to deal with the disputes/claims. Ugh. Sellers are the ones who actually earn PayPal their profits so why are we continuously punished for the actions of fraudulent buyers?
Just an update (but I also made a new post as this situation has gotten RIDICULOUS now): PayPal decided the claim (PP-001-635-975-422) in the BUYER'S FAVOR and is allowing them return the items that they STILL DON'T HAVE YET as per the tracking information online for a full refund!!! I'm utterly dumbfounded at how this is possible. How can a buyer return items to me that he doesn't even have since they haven't even been delivered to him yet?! PayPal is seriously going to grant him a $2500 refund for sending me an empty box or God-knows-what? WHAT AN ABSOLUTE SHAM and I can't believe they'd let a scammer blatantly get away with this! I mean, what kind of "Seller Protection" is there if buyers can win a SNAD claim for items that clearly haven't even been delivered to them yet and are still being processed by customs??? SHAME ON YOU PAYPAL for letting this sort of nonsense take place! I'm going to fight and appeal this claim with every effort that I have as this is BEYOND evidence of PayPal's ineptitude. Whatever automated system they rely on for reviewing claims isn't even competent enough to note that an SNAD claim isn't even POSSIBLE if the items haven't even arrived! UNBELIEVABLE.
I cannot find any logic in that at all.
If there were a scientific investigation involved, PayPal would have, could have, should have simply contacted customs to verify your testimony. God! the whole mess borders on corruption as it is way beyond negligence especially with such a high value purchase. Something is very wrong here.
I feel your pain. My account has been compromised too many times by scammers and hackers. Hmm. Maybe Paypal has been compromised??? And it is not like we can even communicate with a real person at either end.
Well, in anticipation of being further ignored and simultaneously penalized, I shall have unfortunately begin a search for another reputable SECURE online source for my business transactions. I will let you know if I find anything good out there.
What a different world we live in huh?