Racketeers

[CaptnDev]

Hi, 

is any other PayPal user suffering issues with PayPal's refund policies and criminal racketeers advertising quality products, then sending cheap knock offs of the product and when you complain they then offer a discount for you to keep the cheap product or you have to send it back to a postal address in China at your expense???

I have suffered this a few times from sales on social media and online advertisements. I pay using PayPal expecting protection from dodgy scammers only to find that they are manipulating PayPal's return policy to prevent a full refund.

it seems PayPal is aiding these scammers by this return policy ,or scammers and racketeers are  using this policy to take advantage of unsuspecting buyers who order and pay for items that were advertised, in good faith, only to be sent something completely different, often fake branded or unknown brand replacements, then these crims offer a discount or a refund ONLY when you have to pay expensive postage to a different country.

This has happened to me a few times now and is now happening more frequently. An example of this happened to me recently, where as I purchased a quality brand fishing reel from an online advertisement on facebook. the advertisement was for a quality PENN Torque II TRQII7500 spinning reel, with links to an official PENN video of the fishing reel in action. The company said it was an anniversary sale and that they now have Australian based warehouse outlets for ease of transaction. After ordering and paying for the PENN reel, about a month later I received an unknown, cheap plastic fishing reel called an AIDE9000. This was nowhere near the quality of the fishing reel advertised, ordered and paid for! When I contacted the seller and informed them that this was not the fishing reel advertised I received an email from their so called customer service team, telling me, in their words, that "the advertisement was misleading "and offered me a 15% discount, or I could send the item back to their logistics centre in China at my expense, with a note that this was very expensive and no refund would be given if it didn't return. I continued to receive emails from them privately, even offering another 30% refund even after I had contacted PayPal to report the scam but I found it impossible to forward the sellers private communication to PayPal as proof as PayPal would not accept any email I sent them, not even as proof of the scam.

This is a deliberate scam by racketeers to deceive buyers into giving up their hard earned cash for what they believe are quality products only to receive cheap rubbish from China and they then use and take full advantage of PayPal's failing return policy. This is not protecting buyers, it is helping scammers con unsuspecting customers out of their cash. In Australia, it is criminal to advertise a product  but then send another inferior product instead and it is up to the seller to organise return postage/shipping if required for refund. PayPal is allowing bogus sellers by insisting that when this happens it is the buyers responsibility for return shipping. If these sellers advertise a quality product then deliberately, or inadvertently, send a completely different product, it should be up to them to organise and pay for return shipping as this is their doing, not the buyers. PayPal is allowing this because these fraudulent sellers have found a loophole in PayPal's policies. For me, this was not only very expensive to return the fake product, there was no guarantee that they would pay a refund if I followed their instructions,  and that is a risk the buyer shouldn't face, as once a scammer, always a scammer.  In this instance i have had to go above PayPal to my bank to report this mess and get a refund. This is happening by PayPal's failed policy and as much as I have reported this to them, they continue to aid these criminal racketeers by allowing this practise. When a substitute product is sent and sent from your home country, it should be the sellers responsibility to return and refund that fake product, NOT the onus of the unsuspecting buyer who has just been conned out of their money. This is NOT buyer protection, it is racketeers protection. A simple change in PayPal policy would deter bogus sellers from scamming buyers. If the seller had to organise the return shipping on fake products they would NOT do this as there is NO intensive or advantage for them...

[Tokenmac]

HI I have had exactly the same problem with a company calling themselves lognm.com They are advertising a Shimano Stella reel, and giving a California address. They sent a cheap and nasty reel in its place, I opened a dispute with PayPal, but it looks like they are going to side with the scammers. I also have had private Emails from the company, who actually admit that they don't sell the reel they are advertising, therefore admitting it is a scam. However I cannot inform PayPal of this as they will not except the Emails.

These companies have found a loophole in PayPal's policies which these companies are exploiting. PayPal need to step up and change their polisy to support the customer not the scammer.

Theere are other threads on this forum of a very similar nature, and there are hundreds of customers being scammed with the knowledge of PayPal who seem to be complicit in these scams. 

[CaptnDev · Accepted solution]

I can only suggest to go direct to your bank/card provider and start a dispute with them. share that you have tried to go through the PayPal dispute resolution process to no avail, and suggest that the PayPal process is failing consumers as fraudsters are taking advantage of this return policy loophole. If enough complaints are made PayPal will have to change their policy to uphold consumer rights. As it stands, PayPal is aiding fraudsters, scammers and racketeers in these bogus scams.

[nobbyace1]

Hi I have recently ordered a cookware pan set from Prettypilus.com After several weeks   I received a small jiffy bag containing a cheap metal card case. I contacted the seller and was told they made a mistake due to their inattention ?? Further emails proved pointless and then I escalated the case to PayPal resolution. I am now informed that the seller will refund but ONLY if I return the unwanted ''mistake '' to them in China all at my expense. Obviously this is a scam and PayPal are complicit in aiding this as they will not intervene because the seller has offered the refund ( knowing full well that it's not practical or financially viable to post back to China)

So much for buyer protection policy, I have checked several scam websites and it appears this  seller has made this ''mistake '' countless times all with the same outcome for the buyer 

[CaptnDev]

It seems there is a spike in this sort of behaviour out of China since the COVID-19 thing started and people are home, bored and purchasing online and these mongrels are taking advantage of the loop holews in the PayPal dodgy return policy. If the seller sends the wrong goods, either by mistake or deliberately deceitful as in a scam, it should be up to the seller to organise and pay for the return and a full refund. By PayPal allowing these con artists to dictate return payments, the unsuspecting buyer gets shafted twice and ends up financially penalised. PayPal needs to jump on this fast as it seems these types of scams are on the increase and PayPal is aiding in these scams because of their return policy...

[james__deadman]

We have also been scammed by a Chinese seller (happens a lot I think!). I think it is disgraceful that PayPal do not force the seller to pay for return postage if we can prove that the item received is not as described. Why should the buyer pay any return postage when they are not at fault, and this is why sellers/scammers get away with it because they know that they win either way. PayPal needs to improve the protection for buyers..

[CaptnDev]

Sadly I don't think PayPal is listening to, or protecting victims of these fraudulent sellers. They have not responded or advised of updates on any policy change to provide protection against these types of scams and therefore continue to aid fraudulent merchants. For this part PayPal is aiding these fraudsters in their scams and unsuspecting buyers are not only being ripped off but are being penalised further financially by having to pay for the returned fake item, which also poses the threat, with no guarantee, that an item returned to the return address given will actually be acknowledged as being returned, leaving the buyer further out of pocket. These are scammers, they have already been fraudulent in their dealings and have gone to great lengths to get away with it because of PayPal's policy, so how can they be trusted to acknowledge the returned item has arrived back at the return address given? A lose - lose situation for the unsuspecting buyers who have already been conned out of their money through false advertisement. If PayPal was genuine about protection of their customers they would change their return policy regarding fraudulent advertisement and make the seller making the false claims, or sending fake and inferior products pay for the return of the wrong product sent...