PayPal agrees transaction was fraud but asks me to pay $4,046.37

[twocatstech]

My PayPal nightmare started on Sept. 4, 2020, when a fraudulent purchase for $4,371.75 was made with my PayPal account from eBay. 

I discovered this purchase several hours later when I tried to use my PayPal debit card at a local store and it was declined. I knew I had enough money in the account to cover the purchase so I went home and discovered the fraud. 

Next, I contacted PayPal and the first people I spoke to said that I would have to pay $4,046.37 (note that I had a $325.38 in the account.) to resolve the problem. I had to explain the problem several times and then the service rep told me to contact the fraud department. 

I called the fraud department and after waiting for 50 minutes, I spoke to a fraud representative. She was very nice and said an investigation had been opened and they would get back to me.

She also told me that after a payment request to a bank bounces, a second request for payment is automatically set up. Unfortunately, there is no way for PayPal to cancel the second request, she added. 

This means that after the payment issue is resolved, a few days afterward, PayPal tries to draw the amount from the account a second time. 

This is exactly what happened.PayPal sent me an email (see correspondence below) explaining PayPal has found that I am a victim of fraud, but rather than resolve the problem.  

Now they tell me that they HAVE NO PLANS to reimburse the $325.38 taken from my account and they want me to pay them $4.046.37.

Fortunately, I have documented my correspondence with PayPal, including an email from PayPal agreeing that the transaction was fraudulent. 

This should be an open and shut case,  but PayPal is putting up a fight and they now claim that I have to pay them. 

I am wondering what I should do. Should I hire a lawyer? I know that I lawyer would want a retainer and if I won the case, would PayPal have to reimburse my legal fees?

Should I report this case to the New York State Banking Department? I live in New York, but I am afraid that this might take months to resolve this case. 

To make matters worse, I lost my job and am looking for a new one. Most potential employers run credit checks on candidates and they would see that I have a dispute with PayPal. 

I have posted copies of emails and messages from PayPal. 

//// Sept.04, 2020 email from PayPal saying they have opened the case. Case PP-I-11319017

We recently received your unauthorized activity case submission. Thank you for alerting us to this possible unauthorized activity. We’ll review your case and then get back to you within 9 days or less.

Here are the details of the one or more transactions you didn’t recognize or had issues with:

• Transaction ID: XXXXXXXX4617 (Note numbers have been changed for privacy.)
• Transaction date: September 4, 2020
• Transaction amount: $4,371.75 USD
• Recipient email: https://eBay.com/help

If we confirm the transaction(s) were unauthorized, we'll refund you the full amount. We’ll also reverse any unauthorized activity or assist you in restoring your account.

For more information and to see the status of your case, log in to your PayPal account and go to the Resolution Center.

\\\\

Four days later, PayPal sent me the message saying the case was fraudulent and has been resolved. However, PayPal never returned my $325.38 that was in the account before the transaction.

Also, note that in the message below PayPal did NOT include the transaction ID and the refund amount. 

//// Sept.14, 2020 email from PayPal saying the case has been resolved. Case PP-I-11319017

Hello XXXX XXXXXX, (Name removed for privacy)

We've determined the payment(s) in question were unauthorized and have refunded the full amount for the following transactions - 

Here are the transaction details:

• Date: September 4, 2020
• Transaction amount: $4,371.75 USD
• Transaction ID: 
• Total amount refunded: 

The money will be refunded to your PayPal balance.

\\\\

Now, PayPal has turned aggressive. 

I have contacted support through the Message Center and they keep asking me to put money in the account, even though they have found the transaction was fraudulent. I have tried reaching the fraud department by phone, and I keep getting a message saying that they are too busy.

This has been going on for two weeks!

Here are some of the messages that I received from PayPal employees through my Message Center account. As you can read, it started out well, but then refused the help and started telling to put money in my account. 

///// Sept.28 from Cristy on Message Center

Thank you for reaching us today. My name is Cristy and I'll be happy to help you with your concern. I can sense the urgency and importance of this matter Stephen. I can schedule you a phone call, done by our Senior Specialist since our phone servicing as of this time is temporarily unavailable, it would also be greatly appreciated if you may share a bit of information on the issues your having? looking on the previous conversation looks like you contacted us about your dispute case of an unauthorized charge.

I will schedule a phone call for you, so that we can speak and covered everything for you. Please keep your lines open, the callback may be in 24-72 hours.

For the meantime I will transfer this conversation, to our limitations team to further provide you additional details. Please note, the reply may not be immediate. Once a specialist is available and responds to the thread, PayPal will send you a notification.

\\\\\\

And in the next note, another rep tells me that the previous employee scheduled a phone call. I still have not received any calls from PayPal. This is horrible customer service. 

////// Sept. 29 from Cherry Valerie on Message Center

It seems that the previous teammate already set a callback. I'll leave this chat open just in case you need more help. Feel free to reply whenever you're ready and we'll reply as soon as we can.

\\\\\\\

The next two messages are from PayPal employees explaining that they have looked at my account and they have determined that I owe $4,046.37 and to put money in the account. 

They clearly have not looked at my account because they would have seen the fraudulent transaction and noticed that there are two payment attempts for the same amount.   

//// Oct. 1, 2020 message from Haritha on Message Center

Stephen, I understand your concern and I apologize for any trouble caused. I will try my best to help you in this situation. Regarding the amount of $4046.37, I see that we have refunded that amount of $4371.75 to your bank account on September 14th and the amount of 4.46.37 has been debited from your PayPal account on September 17th as we were unable to cover the funds from your bank account due to insufficient funds. Your bank account has not been charged any amount for the purchase of $4046.37. I suggest you to contact your bank or check the bank statement for simplification.

You can add funds to your PayPal account from your bank account and within 5 business days the negative amount will be cleared or you call our Collections team a[Removed. Phone #s not permitted]

I hope this helps. Would you like me to check anything else for you? Feel free to reply whenever you're ready and we'll reply as soon as we can.

////

//// Oct. 2, 2020 message from Geraldine on Message Center

I understand that but as per checking here on our system shows that we reimbursed your bank account ending in 62 last September 14, 2020 for the amount of $4,371.75 under the transaction ID ( XXXXXX037836). You have to add funds that refund we provided since we fronted the funds first for the transaction to go thru please return the $4,046.37 by adding funds form your bank account. I hope you understand.

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If you have read this far, thank you for reading. Any advice would be appreciated. I have had a PayPal account for more than 20 years and have never had a problem until now. I look forward to the day when eBay starts offering other payment methods. 

This experience has soured me on PayPal.

[Miss-Designs]

Have you gotten anything from your bank summarizing the activity to show them that they did not in fact "Front you the money" as they claimed? And have you had any luck as of yet with actually verbally speaking with a representative? Because if not then I'd definitely recommend pursuing that. Even if I had to call at least once in three morning afternoon and evening, accompanied by written messages demanding that someone with actual authority, not by wrote repeaters they call customer service agents, but insisting at the very least either a lead supervisor or higher management employee needs to return my call if they continuously insist on not answering my attempts at reaching them. Make it clear that between all the copies of the communications you've received, including the admittance of owing you the money, along with the fact of how large a sum is in question as well as any verifications and proof from your bank that you did NOT receive the erroneous figures they are trying to claim, that there is in no way any chance of it being settled, especially not in their favor, without an actual conversation involving someone there not only able to handle their job but also someone who actually puts in the work. I'd just have too reiterate that as long as the only communication you're getting are those just repeating unqualified and/or false information, or those who only repeat the memorized party lines from training manuals and the trainers who encourage them to never close in a way that is against their own interests, ie: those who never actually attempt too work for the honest and fair resolution that you deserve and are owed, that it just seems it'd cause an impossibility at ever coming up with a resolution that favors either of you. So I respectfully request the callback I was promised (however long ago) so we can work through this and clear up any miscommunication or misinformation that is obviously blocking our ability to bring a close to this situation that so obviously is having a significant effect on those harmed by then original events. But most of my family and friends would jump right in and confirm that I'm a bit forward, stubborn, and unwilling to let go of something especially when it involves anything serious or personally devastating or effecting. And most definitely if it involves an obviously hurtful or underhanded situation where someone, even if not me personally, is being taken advantage of or tricked, even if only cuz laziness makes them not even try. Good luck and I'd be curious to find out how it turns out. And as a lot of the contributors have on the bottom of their messages, something about it only being opinion or something & not trained advice.