Another Shenzhen Soweway Logistics scam victim

[jugheadnaut]

Like many on this board, I fell victim to one of the scams from Shenzhen Soweway International Logistics Company. In my case, it was the kitchen rack scam, where they advertise a behind the sink kitchen rack and after much delay send you a tiny dollar store cutlery drainer basket. An important thing to keep in mind about this scam is that the price is strategically chosen to game PayPal's Buyer Protection Program. This program will generally allow you to return merchandise you can prove is fraudulent for a refund, but only upon return of the product. In this case, the cost of the return will far exceed what was originally paid (in my case tracked return to Hong Kong would have cost at least $60). PayPal knows this is going on, but continues to act as an accomplice for this seller. Here's a rough summary of the events I encountered:

- Ordered the item back in April, from a company with a different storefront name (in my case it was ourdancer10.com... as I found out later they use a wide variety of storefront names which continuously pop in and out of existence). The only way to see that I was actually dealing with Shenzhen Soweway was looking at the PayPal invoice). The storefront and all correspondence was made to look as if it was from the fictitious ourdancer10.com

- received the item 45 days after purchase (seller originally advertised 15-20 days delivery) and immediately noticed the envelope was far too small for the item I purchased

- Opened the item and saw what I received and that it was completely different to what I had purchased

- Immediately tried to contact the seller and noticed the original web storefront was gone. Found the original confirmation e-mail and attempted to correspond with them, but all e-mails bounced, as they apparently only use this e-mail for outgoing messages, and just let incoming messages accumulate until they exhausted gmail's space quota.

- Opened a dispute with PayPal. Seller responded through the dispute mechanism and played dumb, as if this was simply a mistake. Eventually offered a full refund with return of the product to Hong Kong or a 20% refund without return.

- Of course, by this time, I had googled them and knew what was up. I told them I demanded a full refund and would not negotiate with them and take it to PayPal if I didn't get the refund. At this point, I still had some faith in PayPal's pledge to protect their customers. This would turn out to be sadly misplaced.

- Escalated to PayPal, but they simply punted back to the seller who reiterated their full refund for a return offer. At this point PayPal's dispute resolution mechanism only allows you to enter tracking information for the return, not continue the dispute. As it's the only way forward, I entered 'N/A' for the tracking number and stated the reason why a return was completely infeasible in the comments

- A few days later, PayPal denied the claim.

- I moved on to PayPal support trying to appeal this.

- The first PayPal support person said (via chat) I had the right to appeal within 10 days, and when I told them I had no Appeal button in the dispute resolution screen, gave me an e-mail address to appeal the claim

- I put together a detailed e-mail explaining the situation and containing both a picture of the original advertised item and what I received along with the original padded envelope it came in.

- A day later I received a response, which was a boilerplate support message on how to open a PayPal account, and it was clear the e-mail was handled by an automated system and not by a real person.

- Opened a chat with PayPal support again. Second person said the case was denied due to me to supplying tracking information for the return and that it couldn't be re-opened (warning: if you're using the dispute resolution mechanism, don't do what I did. It would probably have been best to open the chat with PayPal agents at the time. It almost certainly wouldn't have changed the outcome, but would have given them one less excuse)

- Second person also said I should initiate a criminal complaint filing with ic3.gov (not even my jurisdiction, as I'm Canadian). This, of course, meant PayPal wasn't willing to protect against criminal fraud themselves as part of the Buyer Protection Program, contrary to how they advertise the program.

- I explained why a return wasn't a realistic solution and it was picked up by a third support person. He transferred me to the 'concern department', at which point things started to turn Kafka-esque.

- PayPal played dumb when it came to the nature of this seller, which of course, they have to know. Claimed to simply be looking for an 'amicable decision for both parties' and re-iterated that because no return tracking was provided, the case could not be re-opened or escalated. I responded that there was no way to interpret that  except PayPal is knowingly acting as an accomplice for this scam.

- The next PayPal support rep said, unbelievably that 'a determination was made by PayPal that the merchandise in question wasn’t significantly different than what the seller described'. She also said she would try to work with the seller directly to resolve the claim (this was the last I heard of PayPal contacting the seller). I responded that pictures had been sent, and there was no way possible to conclude the merchandise received wasn't significantly different than what was advertised.

- The next PayPal support person suggested I request an ACH return with my bank (unfortunately, I was using my bank account as the default payment mode). This is impossible since a bank will only override an ACH if you can prove it wasn't authorized, not that it funded a fraudulent transaction. Fraudulent transaction resolution is a credit card thing, and PayPal's if you believe their Buyers Protection Program claims, which, needless to say, you shouldn't.

- The next PayPal support person came up with yet a different excuse, this one the most ridiculous. He said it was a timeframe issue: "We are unable to validate the quality of the goods the seller is going to receive in return after an extended amount of time in a buyer's possession. We are unable to subject the seller to an item that hasn't been in their possession for an extended amount of time. We can no longer vouch for the quality of the goods due to the timeframe." As if the timeframe could transmute a a kitchen rack that fits around a double sink into a tiny cutlery drainage basket.  I responded that the main reason for the timeframe was the delayed shipping, and I had always acted in the most expeditious fashion at every stage. Of course, I'm well inside the timeframe promised by the Buyers Protection Program.

- With the next PayPal support person they seem to have run out of novel excuses and simply reiterated that the case couldn't be re-opened and I needed to take things outside of PayPal. Which I intend to do. My local consumer protection media and the consumer protection division of my province's Attorney General's office will be the next step.

Unfortunately, if this happens to you, it's least frustrating to accept you won't be getting your money back, and hopefully it was only $30-40 as in my case and you can treat it as payment for a lesson learned. Know that PayPal is on the side of the scammers, and never make payments using PayPal, and if you see an online vendor who only takes PayPal, treat this as if he only takes direct bank transfer or iTunes gift cards. If for some reason you must use PayPal to make a payment, make sure the default mode of payment is a credit card. And please do as I'm going to and report this to the media and consumer protection law enforcement. Hopefully there will eventually be a class action lawsuit or major criminal fraud investigation that will put a stop to this. I have also taken to adding 'Scam Warning' comments to Facebook ads from the like of Shenzhen Soweway and other Chinese scammers.

[ItsMeCyndi]

You’ve just described in exact detail the same thing that happened to me by same seller. PayPal is NOT protecting their customers. I believe a class action against PayPal needs to transpire. By the way, the return address is a fraud address to a gas station in Alabama. I saw a news reporter write if it on their blog. I filed PayPal resolution and they said a determination would be made by July 6 if they don’t hear from seller. Then nothing. I inquired on status and they said July 11. Then nothing. I inquired again and keep getting customer reps who do nothing. I need a phone number for Paypal. I’ve been with them well over 15 years since they started and am getting quite upset...fact is, I’m more upset with them allowing this to happen and enabling it. It’s called International Fraud and I think it is wrong! I have photos in my claim of what I was to receive and what they sent. (NOT what was ordered!!) they sent a tiny bent basket. What’s taking so long for my refund? There are over 600 people on Facebook in a group being scammed by same group through PayPal on this kitchen rack....that doesn’t bother them???

[StephVB1]

Very similar victim. I bought a few items that were never delivered. When I opened a case, they said they would send a refund and asked me not to escalate it. They were supposedly unable to ship to my country, I live in the US, who can't ship here?  I foolishly thought that since Paypal was involved (the emails went through them for the resolution), but no, there is no actual monetary protection if scammed. I waited too long, but now the date is September (it is still April when all this went down). 

[Ynot1234]

I had same issue and at first paypal declined the calim but when I screen shot various scam sites naming the compnay and also the same issue exactly suddenly paypal gave me a full refund while the scammers site offered me $4 for a $80 item.  There should be an international police system for these people or at the very least paypal should not use them once scams are reported