Pitney Bowes Rip-Off

[Mechanicus]

Hi, I'm resident in Ireland and found an unauthorized payment of UK £8.24 taken by PayPal from my card. Searching this site I see it's a major problem. I think it relates to a recent book purchase I made through Ebay; yet, nothing at the time of checkout suggested there was a further payment to anothr party.

It's a scam of some sort, and I've disputed the payment with Ebay. If this nonsense continues I'll close my account with Ebay as I did with Amazon for a similar scam.

I would suggest that anyone having an unauthorized additional charge made on their account to sue PayPal and Ebay - even if it is a small amount.

[kernowlass]

@Mechanicus

When you buy items internationally then you may well have to pay a customs import fee, the same as you do coming through an airport.

So instead of the postman having to collect it on delivery of the item, Pitney Bowes takes it instead.

If has nothing to do with the seller and they have no idea what customs charges you may be subject to.

If you are importing goods then you pay a customs fee.

http://www.pitneybowes.com/ie/support/ebay-support.html

[gergelytakacs]

Happened to me. The import tax and customs I would pay normally should be a fraction of what they charge. It's a scam and I cannot believe PayPal and eBay have not done anything about this. The fee does not detail the exact services provided anywhere...

[GSP_IS_SCAM]

Hi guys,

free speach is in the ECHR (European Chart of Human Right). And I love it how some people here use their free speach to defend the not defendable methods of eBay.

GSP is illegal in Europe, contravenses a bunch of applicable laws, at both EU and national level.  In addition it is a criminal offense to open mail, be it a parcel, if you are not the receiver of the parcel. The way eBay charges you for the "service" is also illegal as Pitney Bowes is a third-party contractor of eBay not of yours (read the GSP conditions it is written black on white) . eBay tries to justify the GSP with "easier customs clearance". Come on guys. Stop believing all your customers are idiots. There is no need the clear customs between UK and Germany, nevertheless Pitney Bowes is active on that destination . Just a rip off. Nothing else.....

This is how the dream team eBay / Paypal work, they make easiest things complex to charge more to solve the problems they have created and wash their hand as soon as there is a real problem.

[Whac-A-Mole]

I do not use GSP,but it has been around for years.

Some sellers use them to increase sales,most buyers hate it /

GSP does charge a fee for their work,so it is not just customs duty,there are fees pertaining to them keeping record,printing documents and repacking .

I am not aware they should not open and repack the shipments,but ebay sellers signed the agreement to use GSP,so do many US mail forwarding services overseas buyers use ,they are in USA and they open and repackage the item .

May be law is different in USA verus Europe,USPS sometimes will open a package if they hear something or smell something,no one ever say they cant do that,

AS to customs clearance between UK and Germany,GSP ship to UK first ,and if you are in Germany or France,you are paying UK customs,which some think is too high.

Best is to avoid any Ebay sellers who use GSP,it is controversial,one GErman buyer claimed the customs receipt from GSP look like a bar bill .Once he bought a laptop on Ebay,shipped GSP,he paid customs,then he took it with him out of Germany,when he returned to Germany,German customs refuse to acknowledge his GSP papers and insisted he pay German customs duty. 

Avoid sellers who use GSP or contact him and ask if he would make you a listing without using GSP.

[Whac-A-Mole]

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@Whac-A-Mole wrote:

I do not use GSP,but it has been around for years.

Some sellers use them to increase sales,most buyers hate it /

GSP does charge a fee for their work,so it is not just customs duty,there are fees pertaining to them keeping record,printing documents and repacking .

I am not aware they should not open and repack the shipments,but ebay sellers signed the agreement to use GSP,so do many US mail forwarding services overseas buyers use ,they are in USA and they open and repackage the item .

May be law is different in USA verus Europe,USPS sometimes will open a package if they hear something or smell something,no one ever say they cant do that,

AS to customs clearance between UK and Germany,GSP ship to UK first ,and if you are in Germany or France,you are paying UK customs,which some think is too high.

Best is to avoid any Ebay sellers who use GSP,it is controversial,one GErman buyer claimed the customs receipt from GSP look like a bar bill .Once he bought a laptop on Ebay,shipped GSP,he paid customs,then he took it with him out of Germany,when he returned to Germany,German customs refuse to acknowledge his GSP papers and insisted he pay German customs duty. 

Avoid sellers who use GSP or contact him and ask if he would make you a listing without using GSP.

---

IT shows you are either misinformed or unfamiliar with US and GSP,when you buy from a seller using GSP,seller shipped to GSP addressed to  GSP agent in ERLINGER,kENTUCKY,not to you.

so there is nothing wrong with GSP opening a package addressed to them,inetrnally of course they know from their records you are the ultimate recipient.

But be it as it may,nothing wrong with opening a packge address to GSP

[GSP_IS_SCAM]

Yes, you are right. That is what many recommend, not to buy from GSP sellers. BTW the book I bought was in the UK not US, therfore no customs to Germany, by all means. Thus GSP is here completely useless.

And yes you need a special clearance to open a mail item (parcel, letter or whatsoever), for instance custom or police officer or 30 years ago the STASI in east Germany or James Bond..... I knoww this rule applies in FR, DE and NL. I guess in the UK too.

Therefore eBay has got it all wrong with the GSP. If they don't give me back the money they have ripped off, I'll start a crusade. I have a mantra: If you do nothing you have already lost. Therefore I do something and you will not believe it; I never lose my time!

[Whac-A-Mole]

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@GSP_IS_SCAM wrote:

Yes, you are right. That is what many recommend, not to buy from GSP sellers. BTW the book I bought was in the UK not US, therfore no customs to Germany, by all means. Thus GSP is here completely useless.

And yes you need a special clearance to open a mail item (parcel, letter or whatsoever), for instance custom or police officer or 30 years ago the STASI in east Germany or James Bond..... I knoww this rule applies in FR, DE and NL. I guess in the UK too.

Therefore eBay has got it all wrong with the GSP. If they don't give me back the money they have ripped off, I'll start a crusade. I have a mantra: If you do nothing you have already lost. Therefore I do something and you will not believe it; I never lose my time!

---

I dont think you understand how GSP works,they have an operation in Kentucky,USA which received all the  packages from Ebay sellers who ship via GSP.

The package is addressed to GSP,not to you the ebay buyer,so there is nothing wrong with opening the package,repack it and labeled with you as the recipient in Ireland or Germany or Sweden etc.

They have to be open and examined and repackaged,to make sure they are not broken,to make sure they comply with both US export and your country import regulations,to make sure it does not exceed the size limitations.

I will give you some examples,Thomas guitar is popular with Australian Ebay buyers,but there is one type of Thomson guitar ,the wood is not allowed for export,so GSP would return your money,and sell it to a local dealer who disposed of it on Ebay .

there is also import restrictions of different countries,certain animal,forest products,gold bars and drug.

turkey is a country which does not allow any gold bar to be imported,gold jewelry is ok,but not pure gold.

There  is also size restrictions,size limit is larger than USPS,that one reason some Ebay sellers prefer GSP if they are shipping large items.

As long as the ebay seller labeled GSP as the recipient of the package,it can open any package addressed to GSP.

nothing wrong and it has to be done.

[GSP_IS_SCAM]

Hi,

well I have read all conditions applicable to purchases in the UK and as much as I could take on the GSP. I guess I understand the purpose and how it works. In the first instance, it is meaningful for customers living in different areas from the customs point of view. Not the case in old Europe.  However I can hardly believe that a book from a seller in Belfast is sent to Kentucky, USA. Pitney Bowes has an operation center in the UK and the seller had paid 3,90£ to send the item to the handling centre in the UK. That would be nonsense imho to export a book to the USA and reimport it to Germany. Basically GSP is within the single EU market completely useless. It makes the whole process last longer and be more expensive. The only ones profting from the GSP are Pitney Bowes. In addition, imposing a shipment company contravenes the EU rule of the free choice of a service provider (we are liberal here!!!)

Whether the implemetation is legal is another story.  If I had agreed with the process and was informed of all details beforehand that would be fine. But I had paid one lump sum supposedly to the seller (12,42£) for delivering the book from Belfast to Munich. It was afterwards clear that there was a third party acting without my agreement and shipping the item from Pitney Bowes UK to Munich. I didn't either have an extra invoice from Pitney Bowes nor was I able to see the amount to be paid to PB and/or the seller. That is simply unlawful. Moreover, I would have never (I mean it) never agreed that a third party touches and repackages such a valuable item. I would have preferred to pay twice as much shipment costs and have it sent directly to me.

In fine Paypal ,UK were infinitely more polite and helpful than ebay/paypal Germany and proposed to refund the extra fees I had paid due to a mistake made by Paypal. That is fair and I say thanks. I now hope to receive the book in good condition.

Have a nice day and thanks for the contributions!

[Whac-A-Mole]

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@GSP_IS_SCAM wrote:

Yes, you are right. That is what many recommend, not to buy from GSP sellers. BTW the book I bought was in the UK not US, therfore no customs to Germany, by all means. Thus GSP is here completely useless.

And yes you need a special clearance to open a mail item (parcel, letter or whatsoever), for instance custom or police officer or 30 years ago the STASI in east Germany or James Bond..... I knoww this rule applies in FR, DE and NL. I guess in the UK too.

Therefore eBay has got it all wrong with the GSP. If they don't give me back the money they have ripped off, I'll start a crusade. I have a mantra: If you do nothing you have already lost. Therefore I do something and you will not believe it; I never lose my time!

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I am just giving one example-Germany.

You are in IRELAND,your GSP package landed in UK with UK import duty and then come to you in Ireland,no GERMANY is involved.

You should avoid Ebay sellers who ship overseas using GSP,some sellers sell expensive items and they use GSP to ship overseas ,but every now and then they may have a low price item like a book listed,and  it is not economical to buy from them OR

you can contact the seller and ask him to sell to you outside GSP,he can make a special listing for you or many sellers have multiple seller IDs,he could list your item under a non GSP seller ID.